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New Ski Pole Technology



 
 
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  #1  
Old February 10th 04, 07:18 AM
kevlaz
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default New Ski Pole Technology

I am a student at Northwestern University conducting a marketing
research study on heated ski poles (basically, a normal ski pole with
heated grips). Any thoughts on this technology? Do you think it
would prevent people who get cold on the slopes from cutting their ski
days short?
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  #2  
Old February 10th 04, 01:21 PM
Steve Pardoe
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default New Ski Pole Technology

"kevlaz" wrote in message
om...
I am a student at Northwestern University conducting a marketing
research study on heated ski poles (basically, a normal ski pole with
heated grips). Any thoughts on this technology?


I'm sure it's technically feasible, but...

Do you think it
would prevent people who get cold on the slopes from cutting their ski
days short?


....no. Are you proposing that skiers take their gloves off to warm them on
the pole handles? Not likely. When I've occasionally had cold hands (like
in Brecken[f]ridge, late January this year) it's been mainly the little
finger, and that has minimal contact with the pole anyway. Better gloves,
massage while on the lift, or conventional hand-warmers are the answer,
IMHO.

Steve Pardoe
England



  #3  
Old February 12th 04, 11:28 PM
Mark T. Mueller
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default New Ski Pole Technology

It is an intrigueing idea, and I kind of like it... The fact is, for many
people the first thing to get cold is their extremities, forcing them to
take more frequent breaks to warm up, or cut the day short altogether. I
follow the logic.

Unfortunately, I think you will have a poor time executing the engineering
required for a good ROI.

First, if the intent is to use the "Pocket Hand Warmers", they do not emit
sufficient heat to warm the hands from OUTSIDE the glove (try grabbing a
warmer in you glove on a very cold day, and see how much heat actually gets
to your hand - this is how "oven mits" work...) Since ski gloves/mittens are
fairly well insulated, you have a significant heat transfer issue. That
means the pole grips will have to be MUCH warmer than a standard "Pocket
Hand Warmer" to cause the desired effect. And if you were going to use the
hand warmers to begin with, I can already buy liners with pockets designed
specifically for these warmers very cheaply... So I don't think that is a
viable option.

That brings us to an electric heating element. These exist, and work quite
well, but then you need a power source. Most batteries do not work well at
very cold temperatures. This can be partially solved through the
regenerative heating, so long as the batteries are also located in the grip.
Batteries tend to be heavy, and modern pole design trend is towards low
swing weight, so you are probably going to have to go with more expensive
Li-ion technology. Forget about putting the batteries anywhere but in the
grip to minimize your angular momentum from pole swing. I won't even get
into battery life and maintenance...

So, I can build you a very nice, compact heating element that can fit into a
grip, without a huge increase in weight, but it will be relatively
expensive, which will limit your market size, which will limit the profit
potential. ROI doesn't look good.

Not to mention due to the fact that to warm a hand on the inside of an
insulated glove from the outside, you need a fairly high surface temperature
on the grip. This opens up liability issues, should someone grab the grip
without gloves. I can design a "trigger safety", but not a reliable one for
cold weather and for the intended use (see MIL-SPEC-810F) that can sense if
you have a glove on your hand and adjust the temp accordingly...

This is just "top of the head" stuff, but although the idea is a good one, I
can't see how you get much ROI if the intent is to produce a product that
actually is useful to "real skiers"... Unless you just intend to make a few
bucks and get out of the business. Then you can make something that "feels
warm" to the touch of a bare hand, breaks after one season, can be produced
in a Chinese contract fab shop for 1 cent on the dollar, sell it at ski
shows to unintelligent consumers, make your money, then shut down the
company and move on to the next scam...




"kevlaz" wrote in message
om...
I am a student at Northwestern University conducting a marketing
research study on heated ski poles (basically, a normal ski pole with
heated grips). Any thoughts on this technology? Do you think it
would prevent people who get cold on the slopes from cutting their ski
days short?



  #4  
Old February 13th 04, 01:32 AM
dingblade
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default New Ski Pole Technology

i think you've got a great idea there.. whether they provide more
functionality than disposable hand-warmers is debatable, but it's definitely
a status gadget that would have a lot of appeal. poles that have no more
functionality than a bamboo stick are being sold here in Whistler for over
$100 these days.. and people are buying them! good luck with it, it sounds
like a winner to me.

"kevlaz" wrote in message
om...
I am a student at Northwestern University conducting a marketing
research study on heated ski poles (basically, a normal ski pole with
heated grips). Any thoughts on this technology? Do you think it
would prevent people who get cold on the slopes from cutting their ski
days short?



  #5  
Old February 14th 04, 03:31 PM
GT
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default New Ski Pole Technology

How about butane (or similar fuel) as heat source? Before attacking this on
the safety angle, keep in mind that there are already butane-powered hair
curlers on the market. If it can be done safely with a product like that,
surely it could be done on ski poles. Butane would generate plenty of heat
and the pole itself has enough room for a decent reservoir. Make it
trigger-activated as you suggested. Cost to operate would be very
reasonable if it were made refillable.

-GT
"Mark T. Mueller" wrote in message
...
It is an intrigueing idea, and I kind of like it... The fact is, for many
people the first thing to get cold is their extremities, forcing them to
take more frequent breaks to warm up, or cut the day short altogether. I
follow the logic.

Unfortunately, I think you will have a poor time executing the engineering
required for a good ROI.

First, if the intent is to use the "Pocket Hand Warmers", they do not emit
sufficient heat to warm the hands from OUTSIDE the glove (try grabbing a
warmer in you glove on a very cold day, and see how much heat actually

gets
to your hand - this is how "oven mits" work...) Since ski gloves/mittens

are
fairly well insulated, you have a significant heat transfer issue. That
means the pole grips will have to be MUCH warmer than a standard "Pocket
Hand Warmer" to cause the desired effect. And if you were going to use the
hand warmers to begin with, I can already buy liners with pockets designed
specifically for these warmers very cheaply... So I don't think that is a
viable option.

That brings us to an electric heating element. These exist, and work quite
well, but then you need a power source. Most batteries do not work well at
very cold temperatures. This can be partially solved through the
regenerative heating, so long as the batteries are also located in the

grip.
Batteries tend to be heavy, and modern pole design trend is towards low
swing weight, so you are probably going to have to go with more expensive
Li-ion technology. Forget about putting the batteries anywhere but in the
grip to minimize your angular momentum from pole swing. I won't even get
into battery life and maintenance...

So, I can build you a very nice, compact heating element that can fit into

a
grip, without a huge increase in weight, but it will be relatively
expensive, which will limit your market size, which will limit the profit
potential. ROI doesn't look good.

Not to mention due to the fact that to warm a hand on the inside of an
insulated glove from the outside, you need a fairly high surface

temperature
on the grip. This opens up liability issues, should someone grab the grip
without gloves. I can design a "trigger safety", but not a reliable one

for
cold weather and for the intended use (see MIL-SPEC-810F) that can sense

if
you have a glove on your hand and adjust the temp accordingly...

This is just "top of the head" stuff, but although the idea is a good one,

I
can't see how you get much ROI if the intent is to produce a product that
actually is useful to "real skiers"... Unless you just intend to make a

few
bucks and get out of the business. Then you can make something that "feels
warm" to the touch of a bare hand, breaks after one season, can be

produced
in a Chinese contract fab shop for 1 cent on the dollar, sell it at ski
shows to unintelligent consumers, make your money, then shut down the
company and move on to the next scam...




"kevlaz" wrote in message
om...
I am a student at Northwestern University conducting a marketing
research study on heated ski poles (basically, a normal ski pole with
heated grips). Any thoughts on this technology? Do you think it
would prevent people who get cold on the slopes from cutting their ski
days short?





  #6  
Old March 2nd 04, 05:41 PM
M
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default New Ski Pole Technology

"dingblade" wrote in message news:EOVWb.36901$QX4.27252@clgrps13...
i think you've got a great idea there.. whether they provide more
functionality than disposable hand-warmers is debatable, but it's definitely
a status gadget that would have a lot of appeal. poles that have no more
functionality than a bamboo stick are being sold here in Whistler for over
$100 these days.. and people are buying them! good luck with it, it sounds
like a winner to me.

"kevlaz" wrote in message
om...
I am a student at Northwestern University conducting a marketing
research study on heated ski poles (basically, a normal ski pole with
heated grips). Any thoughts on this technology? Do you think it
would prevent people who get cold on the slopes from cutting their ski
days short?


For someone that actually got into Northwestern, you are a moron.
Heated poles? Give me a break. If you need heated poles, get your
lame ass of the slopes and go drink your hot chocolate in the bar at
the base. Leave the hill to people who actually enjoy the elements
and don't need to be pampered. Nitwit.
  #7  
Old March 2nd 04, 05:43 PM
M
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default New Ski Pole Technology

"GT" wrote in message m...
How about butane (or similar fuel) as heat source? Before attacking this on
the safety angle, keep in mind that there are already butane-powered hair
curlers on the market. If it can be done safely with a product like that,
surely it could be done on ski poles. Butane would generate plenty of heat
and the pole itself has enough room for a decent reservoir. Make it
trigger-activated as you suggested. Cost to operate would be very
reasonable if it were made refillable.

-GT
"Mark T. Mueller" wrote in message
...
It is an intrigueing idea, and I kind of like it... The fact is, for many
people the first thing to get cold is their extremities, forcing them to
take more frequent breaks to warm up, or cut the day short altogether. I
follow the logic.

Unfortunately, I think you will have a poor time executing the engineering
required for a good ROI.

First, if the intent is to use the "Pocket Hand Warmers", they do not emit
sufficient heat to warm the hands from OUTSIDE the glove (try grabbing a
warmer in you glove on a very cold day, and see how much heat actually

gets
to your hand - this is how "oven mits" work...) Since ski gloves/mittens

are
fairly well insulated, you have a significant heat transfer issue. That
means the pole grips will have to be MUCH warmer than a standard "Pocket
Hand Warmer" to cause the desired effect. And if you were going to use the
hand warmers to begin with, I can already buy liners with pockets designed
specifically for these warmers very cheaply... So I don't think that is a
viable option.

That brings us to an electric heating element. These exist, and work quite
well, but then you need a power source. Most batteries do not work well at
very cold temperatures. This can be partially solved through the
regenerative heating, so long as the batteries are also located in the

grip.
Batteries tend to be heavy, and modern pole design trend is towards low
swing weight, so you are probably going to have to go with more expensive
Li-ion technology. Forget about putting the batteries anywhere but in the
grip to minimize your angular momentum from pole swing. I won't even get
into battery life and maintenance...

So, I can build you a very nice, compact heating element that can fit into

a
grip, without a huge increase in weight, but it will be relatively
expensive, which will limit your market size, which will limit the profit
potential. ROI doesn't look good.

Not to mention due to the fact that to warm a hand on the inside of an
insulated glove from the outside, you need a fairly high surface

temperature
on the grip. This opens up liability issues, should someone grab the grip
without gloves. I can design a "trigger safety", but not a reliable one

for
cold weather and for the intended use (see MIL-SPEC-810F) that can sense

if
you have a glove on your hand and adjust the temp accordingly...

This is just "top of the head" stuff, but although the idea is a good one,

I
can't see how you get much ROI if the intent is to produce a product that
actually is useful to "real skiers"... Unless you just intend to make a

few
bucks and get out of the business. Then you can make something that "feels
warm" to the touch of a bare hand, breaks after one season, can be

produced
in a Chinese contract fab shop for 1 cent on the dollar, sell it at ski
shows to unintelligent consumers, make your money, then shut down the
company and move on to the next scam...




"kevlaz" wrote in message
om...
I am a student at Northwestern University conducting a marketing
research study on heated ski poles (basically, a normal ski pole with
heated grips). Any thoughts on this technology? Do you think it
would prevent people who get cold on the slopes from cutting their ski
days short?





Buy some better gloves. Spend more than $30 dollars you cheap idiot.
  #8  
Old March 12th 04, 03:43 AM
GT
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default New Ski Pole Technology

Are you aware that heated handlebars are *extremely* popular on snowmobiles?
Just because you don't see the need for a product doesn't make everyone else
an idiot. I don't know where you ski, but here in the Northeast it can get
damn cold and forces people inside to warm up. Nothing enjoyable about the
elements when the temperature drops below -30.

-GT
"M" wrote in message
om...
"dingblade" wrote in message

news:EOVWb.36901$QX4.27252@clgrps13...
i think you've got a great idea there.. whether they provide more
functionality than disposable hand-warmers is debatable, but it's

definitely
a status gadget that would have a lot of appeal. poles that have no more
functionality than a bamboo stick are being sold here in Whistler for

over
$100 these days.. and people are buying them! good luck with it, it

sounds
like a winner to me.

"kevlaz" wrote in message
om...
I am a student at Northwestern University conducting a marketing
research study on heated ski poles (basically, a normal ski pole with
heated grips). Any thoughts on this technology? Do you think it
would prevent people who get cold on the slopes from cutting their ski
days short?


For someone that actually got into Northwestern, you are a moron.
Heated poles? Give me a break. If you need heated poles, get your
lame ass of the slopes and go drink your hot chocolate in the bar at
the base. Leave the hill to people who actually enjoy the elements
and don't need to be pampered. Nitwit.



 




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