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#31
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Janet wrote:
lal_truckee wrote: In any case the topic is recreational skiers - IMO their boots should never hurt enough to require unbuckling - not even on extended breaks like lunch - you put them on in the morning, you take them off when you're done for the day - they stay on during the day. If unbuckling relieves pain, get back to the shop that sold them and demand adjustments. Well, maybe you're comfortable walking around in ski boots that are completely buckeled up, but a lot of people (including me) are not. It has nothing to do with fit, pain, etc. I'm just not comfortable walking in ski boots or standing in line so I will unbuckle when I go inside and when I have to stand in a long lift line. I'm especially uncomfortable walking up/down stairs in buckled up ski boots - I feel like frankenstien... And in the east, most ski areas put the bathrooms downstairs! Janet Hmm, interesting. Another point of view. I am quite uncomfortable if my boots are NOT buckled when I'm walking in them. I find support from the rear, but not the front most disconcerting. Further, I also find flopping buckles (the top ones, the one or two lowers I hardly notice either way) annoying. My natural inclination is to allow the front of the boots to support my leg. If it's not, it feels weird. This is, of course, my brain telling me that certain things are true and my body finding out that it ain't so. I never have this reaction in any other type of footwear. At Killington, we have bathrooms upstairs and downstairs and at one lodge the stair connects the bathrooms (K-1, formerly known as KBL). If I know I have to walk a lot, I wear my AT boots. They have a cuff release which allows the cuff to move freely in any fore-aft direction. Some alpine boots have this feature. The AT boots have the added bonus of a Vibram sole. They are not stiff enough to drive my high-end Volkls, though, so I stay on my mid-fat Fischers. VtSkier |
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#32
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On 2004-12-16, David Harris penned:
lal_truckee wrote in : Monique Y. Mudama wrote: On 2004-12-16, DZN penned: .... The response issue also makes new boots feel awkward - you may feel as if you've forgotten how to ski. Be more aggressive - i.e. be as quick as your boots - they will respond to any twitch, so make the twitches deliberately, not accidentally. In short order you will be back on top of things and a better skier. I like this thinking. I remember moving to better skis that I could push them harder and they would react faster. Faster than I thought possible - each time you pushed them harder they would do things better and better - the sort of things that only "really good" skiers could do. My skis right now are of the "cheap and easy" variety -- now that I'm in Colorado, I find that I ski a lot of early and late season, so skis that I don't mind shredding are a must. I suppose I should think about good skis, too. Sigh. I don't think boots will have quite the same amount of effect, but push them hard, try things you think you can't quite do, and see what happens. I'm still not quite sure what this means. I have always viewed my limitations as personal, not equipment-al =P -- monique Longmont, CO |
#33
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On 2004-12-16, lal_truckee penned:
Monique Y. Mudama wrote: Presumably new boots will transmit induced forces to the binding/ski faster and more accurately than your old boots (otherwise, why change?) Well, in this case, at least 50% of the reason for change was that my old boots never fit properly and always hurt. Now, the bootfitter's claim that they could "eventually" get my old boots to look like anything I wanted notwithstanding, I wanted boots that wouldn't hurt. As I'm skiing much more challenging runs now than I used to be, the idea of getting a boot better suited to my current and future ski style was also about half of the reason. But to be honest, I'd rather have a pain-free boot than a boot perfectly matched to my abilities. Hence there are two issues - comfort and response. Most of the conversation has focused on comfort - the boots shouldn't hurt; but there may be a fitting period while the inner boot shifts around to accommodate the details of your foot. That's reasonable, and the way to make it happen is to put down some miles - go skiing. Tomorrow, either Breck or Vail. I'm thinking Breck and a half or all-day lesson, but then, I wonder if I should wait till my boots are fully broken in? Hrmmm ... I also think I have a free lesson in the PEAKS bank ... not sure if that applies only to Vail, or if it applies to affiliates, too. The response issue also makes new boots feel awkward - you may feel as if you've forgotten how to ski. Be more aggressive - i.e. be as quick as your boots - they will respond to any twitch, so make the twitches deliberately, not accidentally. In short order you will be back on top of things and a better skier. Yes, it absolutely felt like I didn't know what I was doing. If I can figure out what you mean by being aggressive, I will definitely do it. Any other ways of saying the same thing? I've already found that this boot demands that I keep my shins forward, which is a good thing and will certainly help my technique, at the expense of my poor, sore legs =P -- monique Longmont, CO |
#34
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On 2004-12-17, Janet penned:
Well, maybe you're comfortable walking around in ski boots that are completely buckeled up, but a lot of people (including me) are not. It has nothing to do with fit, pain, etc. I'm just not comfortable walking in ski boots or standing in line so I will unbuckle when I go inside and when I have to stand in a long lift line. I'm especially uncomfortable walking up/down stairs in buckled up ski boots - I feel like frankenstien... And in the east, most ski areas put the bathrooms downstairs! I kinda like the skiboot swagger -- I feel like I'm about to star in a barfight scene =) The main reason I'm not comfortable walking in ski boots has nothing to do with fit, pain, or the "unique" gait one acquires ... it's that ski boots force your lower leg into an unaccustomed position, and it really tires me out. I'd rather be able to walk with a straight lower leg. -- monique Longmont, CO |
#35
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Monique Y. Mudama wrote:
On 2004-12-16, David Harris penned: lal_truckee wrote in : Monique Y. Mudama wrote: On 2004-12-16, DZN penned: .... The response issue also makes new boots feel awkward - you may feel as if you've forgotten how to ski. Be more aggressive - i.e. be as quick as your boots - they will respond to any twitch, so make the twitches deliberately, not accidentally. In short order you will be back on top of things and a better skier. I like this thinking. I remember moving to better skis that I could push them harder and they would react faster. Faster than I thought possible - each time you pushed them harder they would do things better and better - the sort of things that only "really good" skiers could do. My skis right now are of the "cheap and easy" variety -- now that I'm in Colorado, I find that I ski a lot of early and late season, so skis that I don't mind shredding are a must. I suppose I should think about good skis, too. Sigh. I don't think boots will have quite the same amount of effect, but push them hard, try things you think you can't quite do, and see what happens. I'm still not quite sure what this means. I have always viewed my limitations as personal, not equipment-al =P "good" skis don't necessarily have to cost all that much. Demo a fair number, find out when manufacturer's demos are going to occur at your area, figure out what you like, buy used demos at the end of the year, cruise ebay for a while, take Bev's advice and cruise yard sales, etc. The trick is to know what you want so that when you see them for a good price, you can grab them without too much thought. The only thoughts you should have when you reach this point concern the condition of the skis you are considering. Notice that this advice is NOTHING like my boot advice. My experience is that skis are much less important to skiing than boots. I just came back from Tahoe after skiing three days on near bottom of the line rental skis. Had a blast, even on the crust at Alpine. Ask lal. VtSkier |
#36
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Monique Y. Mudama wrote:
On 2004-12-17, Janet penned: Well, maybe you're comfortable walking around in ski boots that are completely buckeled up, but a lot of people (including me) are not. It has nothing to do with fit, pain, etc. I'm just not comfortable walking in ski boots or standing in line so I will unbuckle when I go inside and when I have to stand in a long lift line. I'm especially uncomfortable walking up/down stairs in buckled up ski boots - I feel like frankenstien... And in the east, most ski areas put the bathrooms downstairs! I kinda like the skiboot swagger -- I feel like I'm about to star in a barfight scene =) The main reason I'm not comfortable walking in ski boots has nothing to do with fit, pain, or the "unique" gait one acquires ... it's that ski boots force your lower leg into an unaccustomed position, and it really tires me out. I'd rather be able to walk with a straight lower leg. I chimed into this thread a while ago and forgot to mention that I *never* walk (especially in ski boots) when I can ski. I'll put the skis on even when it means an uphill skate to get to the lift. I'll put my skis on to slide down to the peak restaurant after getting off the gondola so I don't have to walk 50 yards. etc.etc. My earlier post was about walking in unbuckled boots. VtSkier |
#37
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VtSkier wrote:
Had a blast, even on the crust at Alpine. Ask lal. True |
#38
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VtSkier wrote in
: Monique Y. Mudama wrote: On 2004-12-16, David Harris penned: .... I don't think boots will have quite the same amount of effect, but push them hard, try things you think you can't quite do, and see what happens. I'm still not quite sure what this means. I have always viewed my limitations as personal, not equipment-al =P .... I just meant the very opposite: some of your limitations may have been equipmental, and you may now be able to jump up a level in skiing, just because of the equipment. This is based on switching brands/shapes/lengths/uptodatedness of skis and being able to ski lines that were just not possible the day before (or more realistically, not possible to ski well...) My experience is that skis are much less important to skiing than boots. I just came back from Tahoe after skiing three days on near bottom of the line rental skis. Had a blast, even on the crust at Alpine. Ask lal. VtSkier That's good, but my experience is that skis are more important to skiing ability than boots. Boots have to fit, but skis can make you better immediately. Having said that, it's not an absolute: Better boots can improve your skiing, and good skiers can make any equipment work. But I'd rather ski in beginner boots and expert skis than vice versa. dh |
#39
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On 2004-12-19, David Harris penned:
That's good, but my experience is that skis are more important to skiing ability than boots. Boots have to fit, but skis can make you better immediately. Having said that, it's not an absolute: Better boots can improve your skiing, and good skiers can make any equipment work. But I'd rather ski in beginner boots and expert skis than vice versa. It seems to me that beginner boots don't come in the (small) variety of shapes that higher-end boots do, so you almost have to get a higher-performance boot to get the right fit if you don't have "ski boot perfect" feet. That being said, the differences from my first hand me down skis (165 K2 Gyrators, mogul skis) to my second hand me down skis (190 Atomic Arcs; I never did have the thigh strength or skill to turn those beasts) to demoing my first shape skis (168 Volkls, I swear I could turn them in a full circle they were so nimble) to my first new skis (178 K2 Powers) to my current non-descript 168 Elans ... yeah, there were huge differences there. But the big differences I noticed were in length and shaped vs. straight. I do kinda miss those Gyrators. I was in such a hurry to "prove" myself capable of skiing longer skis that I probably set my skiing back a few years. And I wish I'd gone ahead and bought the Volkls; at the time I was still in the "longer is better" mentality and couldn't imagine buying a short pair of skis, no matter how fun they were. Stupid. I still fight that mentality whenever I look at skis. -- monique Longmont, CO |
#40
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David Harris wrote:
VtSkier wrote in : Monique Y. Mudama wrote: On 2004-12-16, David Harris penned: .... That's good, but my experience is that skis are more important to skiing ability than boots. Boots have to fit, but skis can make you better immediately. Having said that, it's not an absolute: Better boots can improve your skiing, and good skiers can make any equipment work. But I'd rather ski in beginner boots and expert skis than vice versa. dh I'm controverse, I would just ski in _my_ boots on any skies. OK not Slalom racing carvers, tried those 2 weeks behind too hard for me. (could master one of those 5 years before - Atomic betacarve ??) -- Nobody is perfect not even in failing |
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