Unni Odegard/always wear a helmet

On Sat, 21 Aug 2004 08:34:20 -0400, "Diva" wrote:

I have a right to my opinion. You have a right to your opinion. I know
I am correct in what I believe. Apparently you think you are.

You really don't understand the distinction between prescription
(telling people what they should do) and description (describing what
you do), do you?

Please try to learn about the difference before spouting nonsense.

I'm done with this
conversation. Buh bye!

This is such a classic (that is a pun BTW) approach to an argument by
someone how is slowly realizing their logic might be flawed but is
unwilling to think things through and have their error confirmed.

JT


****************************
Remove "remove" to reply
Visit http://www.jt10000.com
****************************

No this is coming to the conclusion that the moron who is screaming in
you face about how stupid you are and how intelligent and correct he
is is becoming exceedingly tiring. I said it nice. You didn't get it.
You are a flamer.

June

"John Forrest Tomlinson" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 21 Aug 2004 08:34:20 -0400, "Diva" wrote:

I have a right to my opinion. You have a right to your opinion. I
know
I am correct in what I believe. Apparently you think you are.

You really don't understand the distinction between prescription
(telling people what they should do) and description (describing
what
you do), do you?

Please try to learn about the difference before spouting nonsense.

I'm done with this
conversation. Buh bye!

This is such a classic (that is a pun BTW) approach to an argument
by
someone how is slowly realizing their logic might be flawed but is
unwilling to think things through and have their error confirmed.

JT


****************************
Remove "remove" to reply
Visit http://www.jt10000.com
****************************

On Sat, 21 Aug 2004 14:58:47 -0400, "Diva" wrote:

No this is coming to the conclusion that the moron who is screaming in
you face about how stupid you are and how intelligent and correct he
is is becoming exceedingly tiring. I said it nice. You didn't get it.
You are a flamer.

I wasn't screaming. You were the person . If you think being
challenged about logical flaws in your own thinking means the other
person must be screaming, I think you are revealing your own
insecurities.

In any case, you asked me questions about being on two different sorts
of drugs, so I'm going to ask you three questions. These questions
are in good faith and an attempt to explore the logic of your comments
in this thread.

Do you think that saying to someone "Never rollerski without a helmet"
is a description of what you do, an attempt to tell them what do, or
both?

The second question involves a little context. My mother lives on an
island off the coast of Cape Cod in Massachusetts. On that island is a
network of bike paths in the middle of a state forest. The paths are
almost completely flat and generally straight, so you can see a long
distance on them. In November (a time when I visit her and do some
rollerskiing or rollerblading) the island is very empty, and when I
spend an hour on these paths I will never see more than five people
and have _never_ seen a car on the paths.

Here is the second question. If you were visiting us and had a chance
to go rollerskiing on the paths on a nice fall day, but did not have a
helmet, would you do it?

Third, if someone else went rollerskiing on those same paths without a
helmet, would you say they were an idiot?

JT



****************************
Remove "remove" to reply
Visit http://www.jt10000.com
****************************

1. Rabbit causes distraction.
2. Eyes are diverted momentarily.
3. Rollerski finds rock.
4. Rock stops wheel.
5. Wheel stops skier.
6. Ground stops skier's head.
7. Family stops life support.
8. Joe Schmo gets a new liver.

Possible?

Hey, america needs more organ donors right? Support organ donation !!

jw
milwaukee
(I know a couple people personally that could use an organ or two).




jw
milwaukee

On 21 Aug 2004 20:01:13 GMT, (J999w) wrote:

1. Rabbit causes distraction.
2. Eyes are diverted momentarily.
3. Rollerski finds rock.
4. Rock stops wheel.
5. Wheel stops skier.
6. Ground stops skier's head.
7. Family stops life support.
8. Joe Schmo gets a new liver.

Possible?

Yes it's possible. Anything is possible.

I fall on rollerskis and wouldn't be surprised if I break a wrist
someday. Or maybe even a collarbone.

But a skull? That's vastly, extremely unlikely. The only way I could
conceive of any meaningful chance of breaking my skull would be if I
got hit by a car. But I rollerski on fundamentally closed roads, and
a lot of if it flat. The odds of my head ever getting hurt are way,
way, way smaller than plenty of other activities I do, and probably
you do as well.

Now it's one thing to say "A helmet with probably make you safer."
OK.

It's quite another to say that anyone who doesn't wear a rollerski is
an idiot. You don't know the conditions people rollerski in.

Would you really not rollerski in the nice island empty flat bike
trail conditions I described if you forgot a helmet? Answer that
honestly please.

If you answer is "yes, I guess I would rollerski then" then you are,
according to the original poster in this thread, an idiot.

If the answer is no, I have to again ask about your helmet on a train,
or a cab in a city, or on a bus. Where is it? Why don't you wear a
helmet in those conditions? Remember, anything is possible.

JT


****************************
Remove "remove" to reply
Visit http://www.jt10000.com
****************************

I fall on rollerskis and wouldn't be surprised if I break a wrist
someday. Or maybe even a collarbone.

The thing is these heal quite readily, the noggin is vastly different, closed
vault and all.

Personally, I've given up on rollerskis around here, inlines only. :^]

jw
milwaukee
(don't forget now ... sign the back of that driver's license!)

1) I said that "I" never rollerski without a helmet. I didn't ever say
that you shouldn't. You should read posts more closely.

2) No

3) No

June

"John Forrest Tomlinson" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 21 Aug 2004 14:58:47 -0400, "Diva" wrote:

No this is coming to the conclusion that the moron who is screaming
in
you face about how stupid you are and how intelligent and correct
he
is is becoming exceedingly tiring. I said it nice. You didn't get
it.
You are a flamer.

I wasn't screaming. You were the person . If you think being
challenged about logical flaws in your own thinking means the other
person must be screaming, I think you are revealing your own
insecurities.

In any case, you asked me questions about being on two different
sorts
of drugs, so I'm going to ask you three questions. These questions
are in good faith and an attempt to explore the logic of your
comments
in this thread.

Do you think that saying to someone "Never rollerski without a
helmet"
is a description of what you do, an attempt to tell them what do, or
both?

The second question involves a little context. My mother lives on
an
island off the coast of Cape Cod in Massachusetts. On that island is
a
network of bike paths in the middle of a state forest. The paths
are
almost completely flat and generally straight, so you can see a long
distance on them. In November (a time when I visit her and do some
rollerskiing or rollerblading) the island is very empty, and when I
spend an hour on these paths I will never see more than five people
and have _never_ seen a car on the paths.

Here is the second question. If you were visiting us and had a
chance
to go rollerskiing on the paths on a nice fall day, but did not have
a
helmet, would you do it?

Third, if someone else went rollerskiing on those same paths without
a
helmet, would you say they were an idiot?

JT



****************************
Remove "remove" to reply
Visit http://www.jt10000.com
****************************

On 22 Aug 2004 04:10:48 GMT, (J999w) wrote:

I fall on rollerskis and wouldn't be surprised if I break a wrist
someday. Or maybe even a collarbone.

The thing is these heal quite readily, the noggin is vastly different, closed
vault and all.

Personally, I've given up on rollerskis around here, inlines only. :^]

I think that illustrates exactly my point. There are a lot of
behaviours that carry some risk. Probably rollerskiing on open roads
with hills and some cars (say in suburgs) with a helmet is more
dangerous than rollerskiing on a flat trail with no cars.

And for you, inlines are safer than rollerskiing for you.

Similarly, I have speculated (and other people outside this group have
too) that helmets could save live in any moving vehicle, esp.
cars/trains/buses where people don't have seat belts and airbags. But
few people where them

And there are many other activities in life that are certainaly
comparable in permanent risk to health that rollerskiing in a safe
place w/o a helmet are. We both could think of many such things that
we do.

So the point I am trying to make to sknyski and Diva is that a
statement that people should never rollerski without a helmet is
stupid. It doesn't take into account the varieties of risks in
different activities.

And it doesn't take into account the fact that unless sknyski and Diva
live in a bubble they both do other things in life that are as
dangerous as rollerskiiing in low-traffic conditions w/o a helmet. So
are they idiots for doing those things? No. There are small risks and
life. Am I an idiot for rollerskiing w/o traffic arond w/o a helmet.
You can guess my answer to that.

But sknski and DIVA _ARE_ idiots for fixating on a few activities
like rollerskiing and saying people are idiots not to use a helmet,
while not expressing similar sentiments about the many many other very
slightly risky behaviours in their own and everyone else's lives.

JT

PS -- I have heard the "brain doesn't heal" thing before. Actualy,
depending on the injury, it can. I have a friend who got brain damage
downhill skiing with a helmet and overcame it with therapy. And it's
also far far easier for a small impact to break your wrist than your
skull.

Truly catastrophic injuries, such as being hit by a car at speed
obviously can cause permanent brain damage or death. They can also
cause permanent spinal damage (I know someone with this problem),
broken hips that don't heal right (ditt -- another person), etc. I
wonder if the people that these things happend to are "idiots" for not
having armor on to protect their back and hip. One was wearing a
helmet and one was not. Both are alive and have their full mental
capacities.

****************************
Remove "remove" to reply
Visit http://www.jt10000.com
****************************

On Sun, 22 Aug 2004 01:43:50 -0400, "Diva" wrote:

3) No

Thanks.

I have to admit I am curious about whether or not you wear a helmet
when on a bus or a train. Or even in a car w/o airbags.

JT

****************************
Remove "remove" to reply
Visit http://www.jt10000.com
****************************

On Sun, 22 Aug 2004 06:30:04 -0400, John Forrest Tomlinson
wrote:

But sknski and DIVA _ARE_ idiots for fixating on a few activities
like rollerskiing and saying people are idiots not to use a helmet,

I think DIVA has retracted or clarified what she said about this (not
clear to me which).

JT

****************************
Remove "remove" to reply
Visit http://www.jt10000.com
****************************