Vallee Blanche...

.... Will be going to Courmayeur in January with a small group of skiers,
differing levels of intermediate, and we'd really like to do the Vallee
Blanche for the first time. Can anyone recommend a guide or group we can
contact on the Italian side?

Thanks,

A.D.

"Le Dieu" wrote in message ...
... Will be going to Courmayeur in January with a small group of skiers,
differing levels of intermediate, and we'd really like to do the Vallee
Blanche for the first time. Can anyone recommend a guide or group we can
contact on the Italian side?

Thanks,

A.D.

Get in touch with the local Guides Society. They're all UIAGM
certified, speaking very good english and french, very very reliable
and professional

Società delle Guide Alpine Maestri di Alpinismo di Courmayeur coop.
a.r.l.
Strada Villair 2 11013 Courmayeur (Aosta) - Italy
Tel. +39 0165 842064 Fax. +39 0165 842357 -
eMail:
web: www.guidecourmayeur.com

"Luca Signorelli" wrote in message
om...
"Le Dieu" wrote in message
...
... Will be going to Courmayeur in January with a small group of skiers,
differing levels of intermediate, and we'd really like to do the Vallee
Blanche for the first time. Can anyone recommend a guide or group we can
contact on the Italian side?

Thanks,

A.D.

Get in touch with the local Guides Society. They're all UIAGM
certified, speaking very good english and french, very very reliable
and professional

Società delle Guide Alpine Maestri di Alpinismo di Courmayeur coop.
a.r.l.
Strada Villair 2 11013 Courmayeur (Aosta) - Italy
Tel. +39 0165 842064 Fax. +39 0165 842357 -
eMail:
web: www.guidecourmayeur.com


Thank you Luca, just what I needed.

A. D.

I'm also going to Courmayeur in January and would love to try the Vallee
Blanche. Unfortunately, some in the party have only recently learnt how to
parallel ski (using the local snowflex). I'm not sure whether they will be able
to do the run. I understand that we would need a guide but I don't want to
attempt something that we'll struggle to finish.
Articles on the internet are very inconsistent. Some say that a good
intermediate can easily do it while others advocate that it's the preserve of
more advanced skiers. Just how hard is it? From what I've read, the best
approach would be from Helbronner since Aguille Du Midi involves a walk along a
narrow ledge (with a rather steep fall into Chamonix!!).
Nobody in our group has done any off-piste skiing - although I've been trying
to read about the techniques involved.

What do you think??

I'd be very grateful for any comments - been thinking about whether or not to
try this run for several weeks now!!

Niall

"NIALLBRUCE" wrote in message
...
I'm also going to Courmayeur in January and would love to try the Vallee
Blanche. Unfortunately, some in the party have only recently learnt how to
parallel ski (using the local snowflex). I'm not sure whether they will be
able
to do the run. I understand that we would need a guide but I don't want to
attempt something that we'll struggle to finish.
Articles on the internet are very inconsistent. Some say that a good
intermediate can easily do it while others advocate that it's the preserve
of
more advanced skiers. Just how hard is it? From what I've read, the best
approach would be from Helbronner since Aguille Du Midi involves a walk
along a
narrow ledge (with a rather steep fall into Chamonix!!).
Nobody in our group has done any off-piste skiing - although I've been
trying
to read about the techniques involved.

What do you think??

I'd be very grateful for any comments - been thinking about whether or not
to
try this run for several weeks now!!

Niall

I'm more or less in the same boat, a confident intermediate happy on reds
but with limited off piste experience. From what I've heard talking to other
skiiers who've done it, confidence on reds is the marker. I've heard that
guides will take different routes according to the party's ability. I guess
the thing to do is to be totally up front with the guide and take their
advice.

I guess it also depends on the definition of a good intermediate. I'd say
that the people in your party who've only just learned to ski parallel
should give it a miss this year.

I contacted the link given earlier in the thread and they've already been in
touch. Will probably try and book one of their guides a couple of weeks
before we go.

Good luck,

A. D.

In article ,
Le Dieu wrote:
"NIALLBRUCE" wrote in message
...
I'm also going to Courmayeur in January and would love to try the Vallee
Blanche. Unfortunately, some in the party have only recently learnt how to
parallel ski (using the local snowflex). I'm not sure whether they will be
able to do the run.
attempt something that we'll struggle to finish.
Articles on the internet are very inconsistent. Some say that a good
intermediate can easily do it while others advocate that it's the preserve
of
more advanced skiers. Just how hard is it? From what I've read, the best
approach would be from Helbronner since Aguille Du Midi involves a walk
along a narrow ledge (with a rather steep fall into Chamonix!!).
Nobody in our group has done any off-piste skiing - although I've been
trying to read about the techniques involved.

What do you think??

Get more experience.

On the Chamonix side, it's not a ledge. It's a ridge.
The French sell postcards of lines of people walking down this ridge.
It's not merely a steep fall, but there are summer time rock climbing
routes on the Chamonix side. And the couloirs between have been extreme
skiied. It's a good black run in good snow conditions. I'd rather ski
down this ridge than walk down it.

I'm more or less in the same boat, a confident intermediate happy on reds
but with limited off piste experience. From what I've heard talking to other
skiiers who've done it, confidence on reds is the marker.
....
I guess it also depends on the definition of a good intermediate. I'd say
that the people in your party who've only just learned to ski parallel
should give it a miss this year.

Look, just take the tram to sight see once and come back when enough
skill is learned.

The problems with the Vallee a
1) its glacier skiing, there are crevasses. Even with guides you can
fall into creveasses or be exposed to avalanches. This is an
unforgiving area in bad weather which can descend quickly.
Serious ice falls to one side.
2) it's at a elevation higher than most peple ski: headache, cold,
judgment impairment, and other issues come to play.

Take a day, just take the tram, have a nice lunch, enjoy the vew
before viewing the exit. Far better to do it with reasonable skill.
Cheaper than an overtended day and more enjoyment for the others who go.

--

(Eugene Miya) wrote in news:4188739b$1@darkstar:

In article ,
Le Dieu wrote:
"NIALLBRUCE" wrote in message
...
I'm also going to Courmayeur in January and would love to try the
Vallee Blanche. Unfortunately, some in the party have only recently
learnt how to parallel ski (using the local snowflex). I'm not sure
whether they will be able to do the run.
attempt something that we'll struggle to finish.
Articles on the internet are very inconsistent. Some say that a good
intermediate can easily do it while others advocate that it's the
preserve of
more advanced skiers. Just how hard is it? From what I've read, the
best approach would be from Helbronner since Aguille Du Midi
involves a walk along a narrow ledge (with a rather steep fall into
Chamonix!!). Nobody in our group has done any off-piste skiing -
although I've been trying to read about the techniques involved.

What do you think??

Get more experience.

On the Chamonix side, it's not a ledge. It's a ridge.
The French sell postcards of lines of people walking down this ridge.
It's not merely a steep fall, but there are summer time rock climbing
routes on the Chamonix side. And the couloirs between have been
extreme skiied. It's a good black run in good snow conditions. I'd
rather ski down this ridge than walk down it.

Actually it's not that bad. It is a ledge - in the winter they cut a
fairly wide path and fix ropes, so you're not walking down the crest of
the ridge (in fact last time I was there they had cut two paths). The
guides will rope the party together. It's awkward walking down with your
skis on your shoulder if you're not used to it, and it's impressive, but
it's not particularly difficult or dangerous. The postcards are of
climbers going down the ridge in summer, when there is no path and the
ridge is sometimes one footstep wide. That's fun if you like exposure!

The problems with the Vallee a
1) its glacier skiing, there are crevasses. Even with guides you can
fall into creveasses or be exposed to avalanches. This is an
unforgiving area in bad weather which can descend quickly.
Serious ice falls to one side.

This is mostly true, though the guides are there to keep you safe, and if
you follow their instructions you should be OK. I don't recall anywhere
on the easiest route which is threatened by avalanche, but there are
crevasses throughout the descent, and one area (the Geant icefall) where
the route is narrow with crevasses to one or both sides. The snow
conditions, on the other hand, are generally very easy, even if you're
not used to off piste skiing - as you're high up on a glacier the snow is
usually very good, and so many people do it that it will be completely
skied out. Very piste-like, for the most part, actually.

2) it's at a elevation higher than most peple ski: headache, cold,
judgment impairment, and other issues come to play.

This is a bit overstated, IMO. I'm sure people do occasionally have
problems with altitude, but I've never known anyone find it serious. Once
you're off the ridge the skiing is easy, and it will be sunny and warm (I
doubt the guides will take you in bad conditions). Most people have a
very enjoyable time.

However: it is *essential* that you should be able to ski in control. As
Eugene says, the main danger is the crevasses. If you ski where your
guide tells you to ski you'll be OK, but you have to be able to control
your speed and direction, turn at will and stop wherever you need to. If
you're still the type of intermediates who find themselves occasionally
shooting off in an unexpected direction the Vallee Blanche is not the
place for you.

Jeremy

In article 4188739b$1@darkstar, Eugene Miya
wrote:
[snip]

The problems with the Vallee a
1) its glacier skiing, there are crevasses. Even with guides you can
fall into creveasses or be exposed to avalanches. This is an
unforgiving area in bad weather which can descend quickly.
Serious ice falls to one side.

I think that this is the problem. The conditions vary so much depending
on weather and snowfall. In good conditions it requires no more than
ability to ski reds. In less than good conditions it is a route with
lots of inherent danger.

I've been down it lots of times by different routes and in different
conditions, usually as a warm up for ski-touring. On one of my early
trips we were caught by bad weather and rain which softened the snow
bridges. One collapsed and I fell into a crevasse on the Geant Icefall.
I was lucky in that I wedged only a few metres down, our party was well
equiped for mountaineering and crevasse rescue, and I got out unharmed.
But it is not a route to underestimate.

2) it's at a elevation higher than most peple ski: headache, cold,
judgment impairment, and other issues come to play.

There is considerable exposure on the ridge for anyone who is unhappy
with heights.


Take a day, just take the tram, have a nice lunch, enjoy the vew
before viewing the exit. Far better to do it with reasonable skill.

Agreed. Some confidence and ability in off-piste skiing demanded. The
ability to do very precise side-slipping with the objective danger of
crevasses to the left, to the right and below is extremely useful!

Mike URL:http://www.path.cam.ac.uk/~mrc7/
--
o/ \\ // |\ ,_ o Mike Clark
\__,\\ // __o | \ / /\, "A mountain climbing, cycling, skiing,
" || _`\,_ |__\ \ | immunology lecturer, antibody engineer and
` || (_)/ (_) | \corn computer user"

In article ,
Mike Clark wrote:
In article 4188739b$1@darkstar, Eugene Miya
wrote:
The problems with the Vallee a
1) it's glacier skiing,

I think that this is the problem. The conditions vary so much depending
on weather and snowfall. In good conditions it requires no more than
ability to ski reds. In less than good conditions it is a route with
lots of inherent danger.

I've been down it lots of times by different routes and in different
conditions, usually as a warm up for ski-touring. On one of my early
trips we were caught by bad weather and rain which softened the snow
bridges. One collapsed and I fell into a crevasse on the Geant Icefall.
I was lucky in that I wedged only a few metres down, our party was well
equiped for mountaineering and crevasse rescue, and I got out unharmed.
But it is not a route to underestimate.

I haven't skied it yet. I have gone up the Midi on general tourism
principals in mind (it was early season and I skied other parts of
Chamonix).

UK friends made jokes of US glaciers when compared to the Mer de Glace.
I would say that coming up from Italy either over to the Midi or
starting from Hellbronner do themselves somewhat of a disfavor.
The lower Mer is an ice fall and pretty broken up. The upper part of
the Vallee is is this nice relatively gentle cirque. And that's part of
the decptive part.

Few things like falling into crevasses (occupational hazard for glaciologists).
Or being caught in an avalanche.


2) it's at a elevation higher than most peple ski: headache, cold,
judgment impairment, and other issues come to play.

There is considerable exposure on the ridge for anyone who is unhappy
with heights.

Makes for a nice post card.
But I would ski it in decent snow and it wasn't filled and tracked with
novices.

Take a day, just take the tram, have a nice lunch, enjoy the vew
before viewing the exit. Far better to do it with reasonable skill.

Agreed. Some confidence and ability in off-piste skiing demanded. The
ability to do very precise side-slipping with the objective danger of
crevasses to the left, to the right and below is extremely useful!

Well better to carve. Side slipping is for novice snow boarders, and
they would find most of the Vallee too flat in parts, but they also
complain of other parts of Europe in the same way. They can't
herringboine or side step.

--

(Eugene Miya) wrote in news:418b2972$1@darkstar:

Side slipping is for novice snow boarders

You've obviously never done a real off piste tour with a guide then, I
often find myself side slipping after a decent off piste run, usually near
the end when you are picking your way down a narrow track through a forest
with patchy snow, rocks, stumps etc to avoid.

regards,

greg