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French Protectionism



 
 
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  #1  
Old February 20th 13, 12:15 PM posted to rec.skiing.resorts.europe
Mike Clark[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 19
Default French Protectionism

I see the issue of French Protectionism for the ESF raises its ugly head
once again

http://www.planetski.eu/news/4683

"A court in France has ruled that British Tour companies are not allowed
to use ski hosts to show clients round the slopes. It believes skier
safety is compromsied. It is a test case and all ski hosting in France
is now banned."

--
o/ \\ // |\ ,_ o Mike Clark
\__,\\ // __o | \ / /\, "A mountain climbing, cycling, skiing,
" || _`\,_ |__\ \ | caving, antibody engineer and
` || (_)/ (_) | \corn computer user" http://www.antibody.me.uk/
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  #2  
Old February 20th 13, 01:11 PM posted to rec.skiing.resorts.europe
Ace[_3_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 177
Default French Protectionism

On Wed, 20 Feb 2013 12:15:56 GMT, Mike Clark
wrote:

I see the issue of French Protectionism for the ESF raises its ugly head
once again

http://www.planetski.eu/news/4683

"A court in France has ruled that British Tour companies are not allowed
to use ski hosts to show clients round the slopes. It believes skier
safety is compromsied. It is a test case and all ski hosting in France
is now banned."


Hadn't seen that new result yet. We (Ski Club) were part of the
earlier proceedings, as one of our leaders was also stopped and asked
in for questioning at the same time as the incident that sparked this.

In our case no further action was taken, presumably on the basis that
no financial remuneration takes place for our volunteer leaders. Even
so, we've changed our expenses system to ensure that (the very low)
allowances are only paid after the event and on presentation of
receipts.

As it happens, I have some sympathies with the French on this. I have
seen, and skied with, unqualified ski hosts, and while mostly they do
a reasonable job, some of them are frankly a menace. I recall one,
from some years ago, whose idea of leading was - "we're going down
here, see you at the bottom". I don't agree that they need to be
qulified ski instructors, particularly with the France-only rulng
about having to do the 'test technique' to teach, but maybe something
on a level with the BASI level one course (which is itself a lower
standard than the Ski Club leaders training, for example) could be
established...



--
Ace
Ski Club of Great Britain http://www.skiclub.co.uk/
All opinions expressed are those of the poster and in no way reflect those of the Ski Club or its members
  #3  
Old February 20th 13, 02:05 PM posted to rec.skiing.resorts.europe
Mike Clark[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 19
Default French Protectionism

In message
Ace wrote:

On Wed, 20 Feb 2013 12:15:56 GMT, Mike Clark
wrote:

I see the issue of French Protectionism for the ESF raises its ugly head
once again

http://www.planetski.eu/news/4683

"A court in France has ruled that British Tour companies are not allowed
to use ski hosts to show clients round the slopes. It believes skier
safety is compromsied. It is a test case and all ski hosting in France
is now banned."


Hadn't seen that new result yet. We (Ski Club) were part of the
earlier proceedings, as one of our leaders was also stopped and asked
in for questioning at the same time as the incident that sparked this.

In our case no further action was taken, presumably on the basis that
no financial remuneration takes place for our volunteer leaders. Even
so, we've changed our expenses system to ensure that (the very low)
allowances are only paid after the event and on presentation of
receipts.


It looks like they were after a single case to use as a test case. At
present the Ski Club might be OK but I wonder how long before the
authorities do look to see if they can come up with a trumped up charge.


As it happens, I have some sympathies with the French on this. I have
seen, and skied with, unqualified ski hosts, and while mostly they do
a reasonable job, some of them are frankly a menace. I recall one,
from some years ago, whose idea of leading was - "we're going down
here, see you at the bottom".


Funnily enough I've had a similar experience in an ESF ski class where
the instructor decided that only those who could keep up with him were
going to get any instruction.

I don't agree that they need to be qulified ski instructors,
particularly with the France-only rulng about having to do the 'test
technique' to teach, but maybe something on a level with the BASI
level one course (which is itself a lower standard than the Ski Club
leaders training, for example) could be established...


The problem with the French selection system for ESF has always been
that they put too much emphasis on the speed and technique of the
instructors skiing and not enough emphasis on their ability to teach or
empathise with their students. In my early years of skiing I had some
aweful experiences with ESF instructors and it wasn't until I started
taking lessons with some of the international ski schools that things
improved.

Mike
--
o/ \\ // |\ ,_ o Mike Clark
\__,\\ // __o | \ / /\, "A mountain climbing, cycling, skiing,
" || _`\,_ |__\ \ | caving, antibody engineer and
` || (_)/ (_) | \corn computer user" http://www.antibody.me.uk/
  #4  
Old February 20th 13, 03:00 PM posted to rec.skiing.resorts.europe
Ace[_3_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 177
Default French Protectionism

On Wed, 20 Feb 2013 14:05:19 GMT, Mike Clark
wrote:

In message
Ace wrote:


In our case no further action was taken, presumably on the basis that
no financial remuneration takes place for our volunteer leaders. Even
so, we've changed our expenses system to ensure that (the very low)
allowances are only paid after the event and on presentation of
receipts.


It looks like they were after a single case to use as a test case. At
present the Ski Club might be OK but I wonder how long before the
authorities do look to see if they can come up with a trumped up charge.


The club will be monitoring the situation carefully.

As it happens, I have some sympathies with the French on this. I have
seen, and skied with, unqualified ski hosts, and while mostly they do
a reasonable job, some of them are frankly a menace. I recall one,
from some years ago, whose idea of leading was - "we're going down
here, see you at the bottom".


Funnily enough I've had a similar experience in an ESF ski class where
the instructor decided that only those who could keep up with him were
going to get any instruction.


Yes, it happens. The Swiss school here (in Engelberg, where I work
part-time as an instructor, BASI L2, for the smaller independent
skischool) has a few who really don't seem to give a toss.

The problem with the French selection system for ESF has always been
that they put too much emphasis on the speed and technique of the
instructors skiing and not enough emphasis on their ability to teach or
empathise with their students. In my early years of skiing I had some
aweful experiences with ESF instructors and it wasn't until I started
taking lessons with some of the international ski schools that things
improved.


Quite. TBF I think the national/franchise schools have been improving
as well, but certainly in many places only as a result of competition
from newbies like us.

--
Ace
Ski Club of Great Britain http://www.skiclub.co.uk/
All opinions expressed are those of the poster and in no way reflect those of the Ski Club or its members
  #5  
Old February 20th 13, 06:06 PM posted to rec.skiing.resorts.europe
The Older Gentleman[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 47
Default French Protectionism

Mike Clark wrote:

I see the issue of French Protectionism for the ESF raises its ugly head
once again

http://www.planetski.eu/news/4683

"A court in France has ruled that British Tour companies are not allowed
to use ski hosts to show clients round the slopes. It believes skier
safety is compromsied. It is a test case and all ski hosting in France
is now banned."


Yeah, saw that in the Times, and had an email today from my tour
operator saying they can't show us around the resort next week.



--
Honda CB400 Four x3 Triumph Street Triple Ducati 800SS
BMW K100RS Yamaha 660 Tenere Suzuki GN250, TS250ER x3
So many bikes, so little garage space....
chateau dot murray at idnet dot com
  #6  
Old February 22nd 13, 12:30 PM posted to rec.skiing.resorts.europe
Michael Chare[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 14
Default French Protectionism

On 20/02/2013 18:06, The Older Gentleman wrote:
Mike Clark wrote:

I see the issue of French Protectionism for the ESF raises its ugly head
once again

http://www.planetski.eu/news/4683

"A court in France has ruled that British Tour companies are not allowed
to use ski hosts to show clients round the slopes. It believes skier
safety is compromsied. It is a test case and all ski hosting in France
is now banned."


Yeah, saw that in the Times, and had an email today from my tour
operator saying they can't show us around the resort next week.



The subject has just been covered by 'You and Your's on Radio4 12:00 today.


--
Michael Chare
 




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