The Skier and the Snowborder

rosco wrote:


pigo wrote:

"VtSkier" wrote in message
...

Bob wrote:

"VtSkier" wrote in message
...


OK, so how about this:
Snowboarding is....





50% attitude
40% fashion
10% talent

Martha


If they had that much talent, we might be able to get along.

VtSkier



If it takes so little talent, you should be a natural. Give it a try
and see
how much fun it is.

:-)

Bob



Clearly you are snowboarder and just a clearly I was
venting a bit about the snowboarders I encounter on
my hill.

What you don't know is how I really feel. I agree with
others here that it really doesn't make any difference
with what is on your feet. A punk is a punk and there
are punks with skis on their feet as well as snow-
boarders.



If you don't think that there's any difference you need to go to an
are that doesn't allow them and get off of the groomed slopes. The
difference is night and day.

The following is the eastern experience. I haven't ski
out west enough to make a judgment about those areas.

Really, it isn't that different. Here's how it breaks down:
- if it involves a traverse, most boarders can't cut it. Those that
do are not of the "scraping" variety
The boarders will certainly use traversing trails in the east.
These are the only "easy" trails. A traverse in the east gets
you down on what are essentially roads in the summer. We have
no skiing areas which are reached by a traverse across a ridge
as I have seen all over the Sierras. The boarders who use the
eastern traverse trails are CERTAINLY of the scraper variety.
You should see them trying to maintain balance and control on
a less than 10 percent sloped trail. Can't even point their
boards straight ahead to maintain momentum. Might pivot to
heel side at any moment.

- if it involves a hike that includes skating, nearly 100% of boarders
won't do it. The only hiking boarders involve themselves in has a boot
track and no more.
Nobody argues that it's no fun to run a board across a flat
trail. Of course a boarder won't skate DUH! Yes they will
take their boards off, they are certainly used to it OR
they will get a push or pole-pull from skiing buddies.

- where the trees are tight, you will not find a boarder
In the east you WILL find boarders in tight trees, 'course
they are the ones who KNOW how to use their tools and they
don't damage much at all.

- if it involves bumps - even intermediate bumps - most boarders will balk
True for MOST boarders. The boarders who look for bumps are
really good and can handle bumps just fine. Here, though, is
where you WILL find lots of scrapers. And the bumps will suffer
mightily for it. Outer Limits here at Killington is touted at
the longest, steepest bump run in the east. Lots of boarders
heel-slipping lots of bumps. Course there are skiers there who
shouldn't be, but by and large they are of the two turn and
stop variety, not scrapers.

Just next door to Outer Limits is Devils Fiddle. It is steeper,
has lots of bumps, rocks and other terrain features and very
few boarders. It is usually a delight to ski when OL is not.

Since the vast majority of my skiing involves one of the above, sliding
with boarders is seldom an issue. In the case that a boarder makes it
into my environment, more power to him/her.

You've left out a lot here. You've basically said that you
ski in tight trees with a flat slope and bumps which
requires a traverse to get there.

More or less standard black diamond trails. In the east, this
is where you will find most of the boarders who have progressed
past the first three days of bumps and bruises. Most of them
WILL be scraping, falling leaf down over bumps, removing snow
from the downhill sides of bumps, creating bumps which have no
line, generally making it awful. Then the groomers come out at
night to fix it.

Blue cruisers are treated very much the same, but they can
generally stand up to this treatment better than steeper trails.

In the east single black diamond trails and blue trails are the
most popular. It seems that if an area doesn't have lots of these
it's not very popular. These are also the trails most populated
by boarders with results described elsewhere.

Again, the only thing I really complain about is the lack of skill
of the great number of boarders AND their unawareness of that lack.

I also take great umbrage at others trying to put words in my mouth.

Someone said that I said all snowboarders are punks. I didn't even
come close to saying that. What I did say was that punks are punks
and more punks have snowboards on their feet than have skis on.
That's my story and I'm sticking to it.

VtSkier
RAC

VtSkier wrote:

(Snipped)

What a great post, Vt! And very well said. I know nothing about east
coast skiing, but next year I plan to visit my sister in New Hampshire,
so I'm sure I'll learn a lot.

Someone said that I said all snowboarders are punks. I didn't even
come close to saying that. What I did say was that punks are punks
and more punks have snowboards on their feet than have skis on.
That's my story and I'm sticking to it.

VtSkier
RAC

One of the things that bugs me a lot about boarders is when they plop
themselves on their butts in busy areas, be it just off lifts, in the
middle of a traverse or other narrow slope, or where it will make it
extermely incovenient and sometimes dangerous for everyone else.

I do appreciate resorts who have benches off to the side for boarders;
pointing to the obvious, and even boarders understand: "Here Is Where
You Sit."

Martha

"rosco" wrote in message:
"And if I have to say it again I will. THEY **** UP THE SNOW AND TRAFFIC
PATTERN."

He's accusing snowboarders of being rude and trashing an area, and I bet he
doesn't even see the irony.

nielsdt

rosco wrote:

Really, it isn't that different. Here's how it breaks down:
- if it involves a traverse, most boarders can't cut it. Those that
do are not of the "scraping" variety

SOBs posthole the traverse...

- if it involves a hike that includes skating, nearly 100% of boarders
won't do it. The only hiking boarders involve themselves in has a boot
track and no more.

SPBs posthole the skate trail...

- where the trees are tight, you will not find a boarder

If the SOBs can fit their board between the trees sideways they will,
and scrape all the soft out between trees. Makes that tough turn to stay
on line rather difficult when you come from soft to firm or even icy at
the crux.

- if it involves bumps - even intermediate bumps - most boarders will balk

SOBs will scrape the back of the bumps to walls, completely ruining the
zipper line.


Since the vast majority of my skiing involves one of the above, sliding
with boarders is seldom an issue. In the case that a boarder makes it
into my environment, more power to him/her.

I've seen a few who didn't do the above - rare, though. But even the
good riders who don't wreck the slope wreck the access trail by
postholing it.

(NOTE: Hard boot carveboard riders don't do the above ... )

nielsdt wrote:
"rosco" wrote in message:
"And if I have to say it again I will. THEY **** UP THE SNOW AND TRAFFIC
PATTERN."

He's accusing snowboarders of being rude and trashing an area, and I bet he
doesn't even see the irony.

nielsdt


I believe that Mr. Pigo Powder said that.

"pigo" wrote in message
...
"What about the smell?" she replies.

"Just hold it's nose".




Hysterical! Seriously funny. I wish you could have seen me to appreciate
the reaction. Thanks for the laugh.

"nielsdt" wrote in message
...


"rosco" wrote in message:
"And if I have to say it again I will. THEY **** UP THE SNOW AND TRAFFIC
PATTERN."

He's accusing snowboarders of being rude and trashing an area, and I bet
he doesn't even see the irony.

No. I'm not.

"Bryan" wrote in message
. ..

"pigo" wrote in message
...
"What about the smell?" she replies.

"Just hold it's nose".




Hysterical! Seriously funny. I wish you could have seen me to appreciate
the reaction. Thanks for the laugh.

That's really what it was meant to be. Heartening to see *someone* gets it.

pigo wrote:
"rosco" wrote in message
...


Attitude begets attitude. My most effective tool in getting along with
boarders is assuming they are human before rushing to decision. Most look
frightful but act like young gentleman and ladies. And that is cool.
Give the "they're all punks" line a rest and find out for sure.


I never said that "they're all punks". But a high enough % sure are that
it's the general perception. And if I have to say it again I will. THEY ****
UP THE SNOW AND TRAFFIC PATTERN.



I don't think I have to say this to you, but GET OFF THE ****ED UP SNOW
AND INTO A DIFFERENT TRAFFIC ZONE.

"pigo" wrote

I never said that "they're all punks". But a high enough % sure are that it's the general perception. And if I have to say it
again I will. THEY **** UP THE SNOW AND TRAFFIC PATTERN.

Skiers, yes. They create bumps. The majority of them are not fast
enough to not get in the way but not slow enough to be treated as
non-moving obstacles. *******s. Worst thing - they often get ****ed
off when being passed by a boarder (especially if they're struggling
and you're jumping around and obviously having lots of fun), and try
to catch up skiing at speeds beyond their ability.