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#11
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foot2foot wrote:
"Mary Malmros" wrote foot2foot wrote: "Mary Malmros" wrote foot2foot wrote: Waterproof breathable "coatings" are useless. If you're talking about the DWR coating that's placed on Gore-tex outerwear, you're wrong. I'm not wrong. The "expert advice" explains in detail the usefulness of the DWR coating. So, I repeat: if you're calling the DWR coating useless, you're wrong. Glad to see you're awake. The actual point of the discussion was, can a coating alone do the same job that a waterproof breathable membrane can do, coating added or not. The answer is no. You've missed the context and point of the whole discussion. The actual point of the discussion was to give some advice to a guy who had skied Colorado in the spring and was going to Vermont in the winter and was wondering if his shell w/ fleece layers would be enough. That is, it was the point before you went off on your witchhunt tirade about all the useless coatings foisted upon the public by lying cheating purveyors of inferior gear that's worse than having nothing at all. Feel better now that you've gotten that off your chest? If you want to stay dry, you need a gore tex style membrane, not just a coating the makers claim is water proof /breathable. It's not. Gore Tex is nice, but not really necessary for inbounds unless you're skiing in the rain or you fall down a lot. Rain much in Montana? //Walt |
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#12
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Mary Malmros wrote:
foot2foot wrote: Glad to see you're awake. Glad to see you're still committed to treating others in a discussion with respect, regardless of whether they agree with you or not. PKB |
#13
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BrritSki wrote: Mary Malmros wrote: foot2foot wrote: Glad to see you're awake. Glad to see you're still committed to treating others in a discussion with respect, regardless of whether they agree with you or not. PKB Another andiron heard from! |
#14
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Mary Malmros wrote:
BrritSki wrote: Mary Malmros wrote: foot2foot wrote: Glad to see you're awake. Glad to see you're still committed to treating others in a discussion with respect, regardless of whether they agree with you or not. PKB Another andiron heard from! You started it with the "intellectual dishonesty" stuff. I responded in similar vein and then apologised. Haven't heard anything back from you though. Can you spell hypocririt ? Go anything else to say on the thread that you thought would "be good" ? |
#15
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BrritSki wrote: Mary Malmros wrote: BrritSki wrote: Mary Malmros wrote: foot2foot wrote: Glad to see you're awake. Glad to see you're still committed to treating others in a discussion with respect, regardless of whether they agree with you or not. PKB Another andiron heard from! You started it with the "intellectual dishonesty" stuff. I responded in similar vein and then apologised. Haven't heard anything back from you though. Can you spell hypocririt ? I can; apparently you can't. Your apology was fine, but then you had to follow it up with a crude, snide, childish personal remark, greatly diminishing its value. The effect was much as if you'd written an apology on a piece of paper and then blown your nose on it before delivering it. I did acknowledge your apology, such as it was; I don't know what other kind of "hearing-back" you feel that it deserves. Perhaps you could elaborate on that. |
#16
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Mary Malmros wrote:
BrritSki wrote: Mary Malmros wrote: BrritSki wrote: Mary Malmros wrote: foot2foot wrote: Glad to see you're awake. Glad to see you're still committed to treating others in a discussion with respect, regardless of whether they agree with you or not. PKB Another andiron heard from! You started it with the "intellectual dishonesty" stuff. I responded in similar vein and then apologised. Haven't heard anything back from you though. Can you spell hypocririt ? I can; apparently you can't. whoosh Your apology was fine, but then you had to follow it up with a crude, snide, childish personal remark, I was talking about my apology for that remark. greatly diminishing its value. The effect was much as if you'd written an apology on a piece of paper and then blown your nose on it before delivering it. I did acknowledge your apology, such as it was; I don't know what other kind of "hearing-back" you feel that it deserves. Perhaps you could elaborate on that. You asked for quotes about Blix "blowing with the wind" and said that "this should be good". I provided the quotes. Only reply was from Walt with whom I had a civil exchange. Nothing from you. So good you were speechless ? |
#17
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bk wrote:
Skiing in Vt this winter. Have only been to Co a few times and always in spring. The local shops here tell me that We'll be fine with our shell type jackets / pants with lt wt chilis and fleece. Is this correct? Typical clothing for VT skiing from VtSkier In addition to proper equipment for EasternFirm(tm) conditions: Base: Lightweight long johns & tee in polyester or polypro Shell ski pants, usually multi-layer but not insulated mid-layer of lightweight fleece pull-over and vest (the vest is one of many, usually NF Denali). Shell parka, good gloves, neck gaiter (usually, but always in my pocket) and hat/helmet and goggles. If it's cold (below 10 deg F) add fleece pants over long johns and under shell pants (duh!). I also have a packable thinsulate jacket which goes under my shell parka. Sometimes this goes over vest if it's RealyCold(tm). At that point mittens replace gloves and I add a face mask. I will also add a helmet liner below 10 deg. The second paragraph list has protected me well to 25 degrees below zero. Anything colder I sit out by the fire. |
#18
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foot2foot wrote:
Ibk" wrote in message ... Skiing in Vt this winter. Have only been to Co a few times and always in spring. The local shops here tell me that We'll be fine with our shell type jackets / pants with lt wt chilis and fleece. Is this correct? If you have shells, you can always layer up or down with clothes underneath the shell. I kind of said this by posting my clothing list to this poster. I have several shells, mostly all I use is shells. It's nice to change the look now and then you know. Indeed. A friend of mine's wife is getting into skiing now that she understands the fashion aspect. But you *need* waterproof/breathable *membranes* in the pants and windshell, like gore tex, helly tech, etc. Columbia, North Face, etc, all make clothes that use the gore tex type membrane. It will pass water as a vapor, but not as a liquid. Good stuff. Waterproof/breathable is NOT necessary for ReallyCold(tm) weather. My W/B stuff is my lightest clothing. I have a single layer shell (Gore packlight) and single layer pants for warm weather. Here in New England even a warm rainy day can be fun as long as you stay dry. I've skied in a full on rainstorm wearing my motorcycle rain suit and waterproof chemical handling rubber gloves. The snow, as long as there is enough of it, is usually really good to ski on in the rain. Waterproof breathable "coatings" are useless. Strongly agree. If your shells don't have the membrane, you might just get wet and miserable. I don't agree with this. If it's cold it's likely not wet. See above. Until recently I only had my rain shell (see above) in a waterproof fabric. Then a ski shop I had done some work for gifted me with a beautiful Scholler Goretex full parka worth more than $400 retail. My main jacket all winter long nowadays when not working. You should be able to pay retail sixty to eighty bucks for pants, only nylon and membrane, no insulation, about the same for the jacket. Since these are usually spring items, you could maybe even save money this time of year. Yes, check ebay also and don't buy from anyone with less than stellar feedback. My most recent rain shell came from there for about $50. EMS Gore Packlite. |
#19
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Mary Malmros wrote:
foot2foot wrote: Waterproof breathable "coatings" are useless. If you're talking about the DWR coating that's placed on Gore-tex outerwear, you're wrong. DWR means Durable Water Repellent and it's function is to make water bead up on the surface as PART of the total function of a Gore-tex garment. It's not intended to be water-PROOF. A coating like the urethane on the inside of my motorcycle rain suit will become a sauna suit on a warm drizzly day for a vigorous activity like skiing. I only haul mine out if the conditions border on frog-choking RAIN. |
#20
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BrritSki wrote: Mary Malmros wrote: BrritSki wrote: Mary Malmros wrote: BrritSki wrote: Mary Malmros wrote: foot2foot wrote: Glad to see you're awake. Glad to see you're still committed to treating others in a discussion with respect, regardless of whether they agree with you or not. PKB Another andiron heard from! You started it with the "intellectual dishonesty" stuff. I responded in similar vein and then apologised. Haven't heard anything back from you though. Can you spell hypocririt ? I can; apparently you can't. whoosh Your apology was fine, but then you had to follow it up with a crude, snide, childish personal remark, I was talking about my apology for that remark. I never saw it here. Can you point me at it? |
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