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how much training ...



 
 
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  #21  
Old July 24th 06, 03:04 PM posted to rec.skiing.nordic
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Default how much training ...


John Forrest Tomlinson wrote:
On 23 Jul 2006 23:49:31 -0700, wrote:

He was also allegedly doing 50 hours a week training.

For road racing or for his mountain biking. he did at least one
24-hour mountain bike race, and training for that then surely he'd do
a few really big weeks.

But tales like "training up to 50 ours a week" don't mean he was doing
that regularly or that it helped his road racing.


In the article it says he was doing several months of 50 hour weeks
when he was unemployed and didn't have anything else to do. It was then
that he entered some road races and started punishing people. Wether it
was more effective than 25 per week is a different story.

Joseph

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  #22  
Old July 24th 06, 07:43 PM posted to rec.skiing.nordic
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Default how much training ...


How much can one increase your V02 max simply by training? Certainly we all
have a physiological limit ...


I think the focus top level athletes' VO2max makes us think it is
imperative in order to do well. We never hear what the VO2max of the
other guys is. Guys like Landis may have a VO2max of 90, but what about
second/third tier guys like Mengin, or Geslin? If you look at the ITT
they (perhaps taking it a bit easy) only output about 75% of the power
Landis and those guys put out. These guys may not win, but they are
most certainly elite top level athletes. I'm sure their VO2max is
someting much more human and attainable than Floyd's!

Joseph

  #23  
Old July 25th 06, 05:02 PM posted to rec.skiing.nordic
Norski
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Posts: 18
Default how much training ...

"I have no doubt I could ride 50 hours a week for lots and lots of weeks in
a row if I were being paid enough..."

Two of my friends are Pro cyclists. One of them got on the HealthNet Pro
Cycling Team, which I believe is one of the top-tier, well funded pro teams
in the U.S.
Landis and a couple others probably make big money.
My friend the Pro on HealthNet seems to make a meager amount of money to
live on. He drives a very old vehicle that is always breaking. Shares an
apartment with several other riders. Many times sleeps on the floor on a mat
if people offer a place to stay. Sleeps in his car.
The other Pro on a smaller team lives the same, makes even less money and
has to work part time. He was hit by a van last year. Lying on the road with
a broken pelvis and dying. When the authorities showed up and started call
for a helicopter to evacuate him, he asked for a cheaper option. No health
insurance.


Paul Haltvick
Bay Design and Build - LLC
Engineering, Construction and Information Technology Services
FSx - Fischer / Swix Racing
Ashland, WI.




  #24  
Old July 25th 06, 06:33 PM posted to rec.skiing.nordic
WasGitchi
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Default how much training ...

Earlier in the year we were discussing how to count training hours.
One idea was to divide your biking hours by 2. Under this method
Landis's 50 hour weeks sound very similar to the 25 hour weeks that
elite skiers are known to train.

Make me wonder...
what his heart rate was during those 50 hours

is there is a calculated load that an athlete can handle per week eg,
15,000 kcals/wk during training, a certain volume of lactic acid
created by the body...

Byrnes-out

wrote:
he rides for living - doesn't he? 40 hrs a week is what a 9-5 job gives
you. If we use the 40 hr analogy (40 is close to 50), if you ride 6
days a week, you can ride 3 hrs in the morning, eat, sleep, ride 4 hrs
in the afternoon. I could handle that (I'd bored out of my skull
though).


  #25  
Old July 25th 06, 06:46 PM posted to rec.skiing.nordic
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Posts: 54
Default how much training ...


WasGitchi wrote:
Earlier in the year we were discussing how to count training hours.
One idea was to divide your biking hours by 2. Under this method
Landis's 50 hour weeks sound very similar to the 25 hour weeks that
elite skiers are known to train.

Make me wonder...
what his heart rate was during those 50 hours

is there is a calculated load that an athlete can handle per week eg,
15,000 kcals/wk during training, a certain volume of lactic acid
created by the body...


I recall seeing a graph once showing I beleive power output over time,
with points plotted in like Edy Merckx's hour record, Pete Penseyres
Race Across America record etc. I'll try to find it.

What one can endure is quite a bit more than what is probably wise, or
beneficial. Take the RAAM for instance. About 20-21 hours on bike per
day for 9 days.

Joseph


Byrnes-out

wrote:
he rides for living - doesn't he? 40 hrs a week is what a 9-5 job gives
you. If we use the 40 hr analogy (40 is close to 50), if you ride 6
days a week, you can ride 3 hrs in the morning, eat, sleep, ride 4 hrs
in the afternoon. I could handle that (I'd bored out of my skull
though).


  #26  
Old July 25th 06, 06:48 PM posted to rec.skiing.nordic
Jan Gerrit Klok
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Posts: 220
Default how much training ...

I think the volume of such trianing hours comes from hands-on-tops
125-140bpm efforts. A pro roadie will still do well over 20mph in that zone,
but it will be easy cruising.
A class roadie I know (vets champ, medical world champ) has no problem
logging multiple hours at an exciting 15-16mph.
While at 130bpm (150W) I could easily do 10 hours (1.5kWh)of pedaling a day
(not every day please), doing 5 of them at 300W would wear me out. Actually,
I'd manage 2 maximum, I feeling good. 250W is more sustainable, but for 6
hours every day...please no! That's like being in the leading group of a TdF
stage all day long!


"WasGitchi" schreef in bericht
oups.com...
Earlier in the year we were discussing how to count training hours.
One idea was to divide your biking hours by 2. Under this method
Landis's 50 hour weeks sound very similar to the 25 hour weeks that
elite skiers are known to train.

Make me wonder...
what his heart rate was during those 50 hours

is there is a calculated load that an athlete can handle per week eg,
15,000 kcals/wk during training, a certain volume of lactic acid
created by the body...

Byrnes-out

wrote:
he rides for living - doesn't he? 40 hrs a week is what a 9-5 job gives
you. If we use the 40 hr analogy (40 is close to 50), if you ride 6
days a week, you can ride 3 hrs in the morning, eat, sleep, ride 4 hrs
in the afternoon. I could handle that (I'd bored out of my skull
though).




  #27  
Old July 25th 06, 07:19 PM posted to rec.skiing.nordic
Norski
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Posts: 18
Default how much training ...

Besides ski racing, I've raced triathlons since 1986 and have watched the
pros over those years. It seems like some of them lose common sense when it
comes to how much training to do, especially the ones doing Ironman races. I
read stories of weekly totals of 15 miles swimming, 450+ on the bike and
another 60+ running. Some of them really toasted their bodies and have
medical problems. A few were able to come back after a couple years off, but
didn't seem at quite the same level. Scott Tinley and Peter Reid come to
mind.

Many people think if they just had the time available, they could put in
massive hours training. I know when I've tried to hit 20-25 hours and get
close, I can't get my heart rate up anymore.

Paul Haltvick
Bay Design and Build - LLC
Engineering, Construction and Information Technology Services
FSx - Fischer / Swix Racing
Ashland, WI.

"WasGitchi" wrote in message
oups.com...
Earlier in the year we were discussing how to count training hours.
One idea was to divide your biking hours by 2. Under this method
Landis's 50 hour weeks sound very similar to the 25 hour weeks that
elite skiers are known to train.

Make me wonder...
what his heart rate was during those 50 hours

is there is a calculated load that an athlete can handle per week eg,
15,000 kcals/wk during training, a certain volume of lactic acid
created by the body...

Byrnes-out

wrote:
he rides for living - doesn't he? 40 hrs a week is what a 9-5 job gives
you. If we use the 40 hr analogy (40 is close to 50), if you ride 6
days a week, you can ride 3 hrs in the morning, eat, sleep, ride 4 hrs
in the afternoon. I could handle that (I'd bored out of my skull
though).




  #28  
Old July 25th 06, 07:34 PM posted to rec.skiing.nordic
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Posts: 75
Default how much training ...


Norski wrote:
Besides ski racing, I've raced triathlons since 1986 and have watched the
pros over those years. It seems like some of them lose common sense when it
comes to how much training to do, especially the ones doing Ironman races. I
read stories of weekly totals of 15 miles swimming, 450+ on the bike and
another 60+ running. Some of them really toasted their bodies and have
medical problems. A few were able to come back after a couple years off, but
didn't seem at quite the same level. Scott Tinley and Peter Reid come to
mind.



my rule of thumb is biking hours = running hrs x 2=rollerskiing hrs x
1.5.

Probably, measuring the amount of heartbeats would be appropriate for
the training load but you probably have to take the derivative? B/c
an exercise at 150 bpm (biking) is 2x as easy (guesstimate) as an
exercise at 170 bpm ( running), but the 2 numbers are only 10-20%
different.

  #29  
Old July 25th 06, 07:47 PM posted to rec.skiing.nordic
prenex
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Posts: 4
Default how much training ...

When MTB racing didn't work out, he switched and started riding 10
hours a day. He did it for two months and then he "cracked" as he puts
it. The effot wasn't that great either. 14-15 mph. Here's an
article:

http://www.pedalmag.com/index.php?mo...item_id =4675


WasGitchi wrote:
Earlier in the year we were discussing how to count training hours.
One idea was to divide your biking hours by 2. Under this method
Landis's 50 hour weeks sound very similar to the 25 hour weeks that
elite skiers are known to train.

Make me wonder...
what his heart rate was during those 50 hours

is there is a calculated load that an athlete can handle per week eg,
15,000 kcals/wk during training, a certain volume of lactic acid
created by the body...

Byrnes-out

wrote:
he rides for living - doesn't he? 40 hrs a week is what a 9-5 job gives
you. If we use the 40 hr analogy (40 is close to 50), if you ride 6
days a week, you can ride 3 hrs in the morning, eat, sleep, ride 4 hrs
in the afternoon. I could handle that (I'd bored out of my skull
though).


  #30  
Old July 27th 06, 12:44 AM posted to rec.skiing.nordic
Peter H.
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Posts: 38
Default how much training ...

I wonder how many people could train 50-hour weeks at any
intensity without developing some kind of muscular or skeletal
problems after a few months. Not many I think, though
maybe it's just an old man talking here. There seem to be quite
a few who attempt, and give up for the reason above,
even fairly leisurely cross-continent bike trips.

Skiing is worse because of weight-bearing, so I'm quite amazed at this
guy Alex Nilsson, who crossed Canada (quite a bit farther than U.S.)
last summer on rollerskis, averaging about 65 km/day for 95 days,
at the age of approximately 70!

http://www.fitstep.com/ski-site/index.html

Best, Peter

Jan Gerrit Klok wrote:
....... While at 130bpm (150W) I could easily do 10 hours (1.5kWh)of
pedaling a day
(not every day please), doing 5 of them at 300W would wear me out. Actually,
I'd manage 2 maximum, I feeling good. 250W is more sustainable, but for 6
hours every day...please no! That's like being in the leading group of a TdF
stage all day long!


"WasGitchi" Make me wonder...
what his heart rate was during those 50 hour


 




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