Combi ski recommendation?

Hi guys,

Just wondering if anyone could give me some thoughts on combi-type skis?
I'm contemplating buying pure skates, but will probably get a little
more use out of skis which skate well but have some grip pattern on the
base for the occasional classic run (on groomed trails).

Does the patterned base significantly adversely affect the skate
performance?

Which skis, from the current crop of Atomics & Fischers, would be the
best/better option?

A local store has some Fischer RCR Crowns in stock which seem to have
the same sidecut as their RCS Skates but with a pretty hefty grip
pattern and what seems to be a stiffer camber... ?

They also have some (?old) Fischer SC Combi's for about 2/3 the price.

Finally, would anyone consider skating on a pair of Atomic Beta-RC-9's
to be a reasonable thing to do?? =)

Any thoughts?

Cheers,
Chris

Hi Chris,

"Chris Cole" wrote in message
...

Hi guys,

Just wondering if anyone could give me some thoughts on combi-type skis?

There are combi boots, but a skate/crown ski is an oxymoron.

[snip]

Does the patterned base significantly adversely affect the skate
performance?

yes. The pattern will pretty much kill the skate glide. Remember: the key to
skating is gliding on one ski. A crown (patterned) classic ski wil stop dead
in the snow when you put all your weight on one ski. No good.

[snip]

Finally, would anyone consider skating on a pair of Atomic Beta-RC-9's
to be a reasonable thing to do?? =)

Assuming the betas are waxable (no pattern) then yes - I've skated on my
RC9s and they work OK. (note to self: always test the grip wax *before*
going 3k down hill from the lodge :-)

Bob
cloudy in San Jose, right now. Is it going to snow soon?

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In article , Bob wrote:
Hi Chris,

"Chris Cole" wrote in message
...

Hi guys,

Just wondering if anyone could give me some thoughts on combi-type skis?

There are combi boots, but a skate/crown ski is an oxymoron.

_ They've been made at least once. I have a pair in my garage
( fischer Revolution [1]?). If you aren't that interested in
going fast they do work.


Does the patterned base significantly adversely affect the skate
performance?

yes. The pattern will pretty much kill the skate glide. Remember: the key to
skating is gliding on one ski. A crown (patterned) classic ski wil stop dead
in the snow when you put all your weight on one ski. No good.

_ This is a pretty wild exageration. Even the grippest no wax
base has enough glide to skate on flat ground and if you prepare
them properly you can get fairly reasonable glide out of most
no wax skis. You won't win any races, skating uphill is
probably not realistic, but you can cover ground.

_ However, I don't know of any ski currently made that will
generally be anything but a terrible compromise. If you get it
short enough to skate it will be terrible at kick'n'glide and if
you get it long enough for good striding, it will be very awkward
to skate on. For most nowax skis, skating is a handy technique to
have in your back pocket when the conditions and terrain are just
right, but in general they don't work all that well.

_ Booker C. Bense

[1]- Exact model name escapes me at the moment.

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[snipped: why you don't want to skate on pattern-based skis]

Thanks for the input, guys. I've resigned myself to buying some
dedicated skates and plonking some SNS-Pilot bindings & boots on them,
and hauling two pairs of skis to the mountains if I'm not sure what I
want to be doing for the day.

Cheers,
Chris

Re boots, make sure of the fit. My feet have outgrown the Salomon
last's width and am about to try Hartjes. Re skis, also make sure of the
fit.

Gene

Chris Cole wrote:

[snipped: why you don't want to skate on pattern-based skis]

Thanks for the input, guys. I've resigned myself to buying some
dedicated skates and plonking some SNS-Pilot bindings & boots on them,
and hauling two pairs of skis to the mountains if I'm not sure what I
want to be doing for the day.

Cheers,
Chris

Gene,

Follow up on your changing to Hartjes skate boots. I decided to go
with Salomon Pilot Equipes instead of the Hartjes that NordicSkater
carries. Jaime told me that the Hartjes are just as good as Salomon,
cost less, and have more room in the forefoot. It was a difficult
choice, and my decision was based more on the proven technology of the
Equipes. I wear a wide shoe. I came back from a rollerski session
yesterday and my toes were cramping. Took off my boots and started
howling because I evidently overtighted both the laces and the collar
on both feet. Let me know what you think of the Hartjes.

I promised Jamie to write a review if they turn out well. He's sending
both the 2003 and 2005 skate models, since the last got a little
narrower but is still supposedly wider than the Salomons. I'll be
looking at the classics later and am currently wearing the Salomon Combi
around the house to see if I can break it in. One apparent downside to
the Hartjes skate is the two-strap closure that can be seen in the
photos. I find the lace closure needs adjusting after awhile and having
two straps, plus the cover, makes it more cumbersome to pull off
quickly. Another possible downside is the taller collar, which might
inhibit forward motion. During a discussion about classic boot flex - I
don't like the Salomon's - Jamie pointed out something I hadn't noticed:
all the Salomons have a two-piece sole, while the Hartjes are one
piece. He claims that gives a more uniform and controlled feel. To be
continued.

If by Pilot Equipe you mean the Race 9 Skate, I'm not sure whether the
current last is actually a bit narrower than the original bumblebees,
the synthetic material is less pliable, or my foot has just spread out
too far for them. All I know is after several days of boot stretching,
the outside bunion on one foot gets really painful after about 1.5 hrs,
even with a moleskin pad. But that's been the story for me with most
shoes for decades.

Gene

nordvind wrote:

Gene,

Follow up on your changing to Hartjes skate boots. I decided to go
with Salomon Pilot Equipes instead of the Hartjes that NordicSkater
carries. Jaime told me that the Hartjes are just as good as Salomon,
cost less, and have more room in the forefoot. It was a difficult
choice, and my decision was based more on the proven technology of the
Equipes. I wear a wide shoe. I came back from a rollerski session
yesterday and my toes were cramping. Took off my boots and started
howling because I evidently overtighted both the laces and the collar
on both feet. Let me know what you think of the Hartjes.

I learned how to skate using classic skis and classic boots. So skating
on classic skis is doable. Not the other way around (i.e. no classic on
skating skis).

Just get short classic skis (say, 20 cm shorer than recommended). Will
have to play with the flex. But get skating (long) poles though.

Bob, I am ready for snow, too. I am moving to SanFran in Sept, will
save myself 45 min each way.

Ah, should've read this one b4 posting. Wise choice, Chris.

smart choice Chris --- smart one. Get one of each

we have done our time skating on classic skis but once you get the
fealing of skating on real skating equipment there is no way back. If
beginner choose some wider skate skis with simple carved form, narrow
in midle and wider at front and end. And not that Fischer "skatecut"
which I predict will go out of production within a few year, maybe 3?

There is one special place where many good skiers skate on classic
skis: Sesilami ski marathon. The last 10km of 52 is freestyle and the
first 42 is classic only. The profile is over a long mountain so these
last 10k are flat or slight downhill and many people do skate here. Not
the best feeling to skate on long classics and short poles ...