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Exercusions vs Scarpa T 4 vs Crispi CXT



 
 
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  #1  
Old September 16th 03, 04:56 PM
Shelley
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Default Exercusions vs Scarpa T 4 vs Crispi CXT

I would like to hear what folks have to say about the Exercursion vs. the
Scarpa T4 vs. the Crispi CXT. I have a pair of Fischer Boundless skis with a
Voile 3 pin binding and am looking to upgrade my boots to either the
Exercursions,T4's or CXT. The last few years I was using the Alpina
1500-leather with a plastic cuff but it has an NNN-BC binding system. I like
the way I've been able to 'kick&glide' with the Alpina's. If it's possible
I'd like to be able to 'kick&glide' with one of these boots without feeling
like I have concrete shoes on. I've upgraded the bindings and now need the
boots to compliment this set of skis. Usually we skin up and ski down
somewhere in the Green Mtns in Vermont.

Thank you.



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  #2  
Old September 16th 03, 08:51 PM
Nick Branch
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I can tell you that my wife has been very pleased with the waxless version
of these skis married with the Vole 3 pin and Excursions. The removable
cables on these bindings contribute significantly to the ability of this set
up to move across territory. I think the suitability of this setup for you
depends somewhat on what you really mean by "kick and glide". If you are
trail breaking or following ski tracks in deep snow over undulating terrain,
the set-up should be ok as you won't really be gliding that much and the
forefoot stiffness in these boots won't be that much of a hindrance.
Conversely, if you are on snowmobile trails a lot, you will find the set-up
fatiguing, because of the stride length this packed surface permits, and the
poor tracking ability of this ski for that matter. Also, you didn't mention
if your ski is the warless or waxable version of this board? The faster the
ski, the more problem plastic boots will be IMO.
Nick Branch"Shelley" wrote in message
...
I would like to hear what folks have to say about the Exercursion vs. the
Scarpa T4 vs. the Crispi CXT. I have a pair of Fischer Boundless skis with

a







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  #3  
Old September 16th 03, 10:48 PM
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-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----

In article ,
Shelley wrote:
I would like to hear what folks have to say about the Exercursion vs. the
Scarpa T4 vs. the Crispi CXT. I have a pair of Fischer Boundless skis with a
Voile 3 pin binding and am looking to upgrade my boots to either the
Exercursions,T4's or CXT. The last few years I was using the Alpina
1500-leather with a plastic cuff but it has an NNN-BC binding
system.


_ You might want to look at this month's Backcountry magazine.
It has a pretty good review of the available boots that work
with this kind of setup.

I like
the way I've been able to 'kick&glide' with the Alpina's. If it's possible
I'd like to be able to 'kick&glide' with one of these boots without feeling
like I have concrete shoes on.


_ That's going to be pretty hard to do with a a plastic boot,
even with a leather boot and 3 pins you're going to be hard
pressed to get as good kick'n'glide as you can get with NNN/BC.
It's too bad the Alpina 2500 is no longer made, that is an
excellent boot for a ski like the Boundless.

_ There are some boots being made for the Salomon's X-Adventure
binding that come close to the Alpina 2500 in support, but
since you've already decided to go with 3 pin I think your
options for kick'n'glide are somewhat limited. I'd take a close
look at boots like this

http://www.karhu.com/gear/product.php3?id=127

_ Booker C. Bense


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  #4  
Old September 17th 03, 12:34 AM
Shelley
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Ok, maybe 'kick&glide' wasn't the appropriate term. It could be some
snowmobile trail but mostly trail breaking over undulating terrain. Or
hopefully following someone else who is breaking trail.

I did get a waxless version of the Boundless but do use skins in some
steeper terrain and certain types of snow conditions. And the Voile 3 pins
have the removable hardwire cable.

The Karhu boot is certainly interesting looking-my one experience with
leather teley boots was a painful one and found my older Scarpa T 2's more
comfortable.

I have read the review in Back Country Ski magazine-it was informative-I was
looking for more first hand information with what folks have tried.

Thank you all for your insight!


bbense+rec.skiing.backcountry.Sep.16.03@telemark. slac.stanford.edu wrote
in message ...
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----

In article ,
Shelley wrote:
I would like to hear what folks have to say about the Exercursion vs. the
Scarpa T4 vs. the Crispi CXT. I have a pair of Fischer Boundless skis

with a
Voile 3 pin binding and am looking to upgrade my boots to either the
Exercursions,T4's or CXT. The last few years I was using the Alpina
1500-leather with a plastic cuff but it has an NNN-BC binding
system.


_ You might want to look at this month's Backcountry magazine.
It has a pretty good review of the available boots that work
with this kind of setup.

I like
the way I've been able to 'kick&glide' with the Alpina's. If it's

possible
I'd like to be able to 'kick&glide' with one of these boots without

feeling
like I have concrete shoes on.


_ That's going to be pretty hard to do with a a plastic boot,
even with a leather boot and 3 pins you're going to be hard
pressed to get as good kick'n'glide as you can get with NNN/BC.
It's too bad the Alpina 2500 is no longer made, that is an
excellent boot for a ski like the Boundless.

_ There are some boots being made for the Salomon's X-Adventure
binding that come close to the Alpina 2500 in support, but
since you've already decided to go with 3 pin I think your
options for kick'n'glide are somewhat limited. I'd take a close
look at boots like this

http://www.karhu.com/gear/product.php3?id=127

_ Booker C. Bense


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  #5  
Old September 17th 03, 08:13 AM
Peter Clinch
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Default

Shelley wrote:
I would like to hear what folks have to say about the Exercursion vs. the
Scarpa T4 vs. the Crispi CXT.


I use the original T3s (about the same as current T4, minus a bit of
development) and a pal uses Excursions. We both like them for
hut-to-hut with pins, a big pack and the odd descent in porridge, but
for pure kick 'n stick over easy terrain they're rather over the top.
NNN/BC would be better for lighter work, the big placcies start getting
more attractive as soon as you're going down hills that need turns in
wild snow, and if you're carrying a big pack you won't get superglide
whatever boots you've got on.

I do use the old T3s for lighter work than they're really ideal for, but
I've yet to try a leather tele boot that fits me as well as Scarpa's
size 43 last and the last leathers I had, though better for lighter
touring on paper, skinned my heels. Ouch for one day, untenably *OUCH!*
for a bigger tour :-(
Also on a big tour, I find it's nice having double boots. You can use
the inners as hut boots and/or get them really dry in front of a stove
without worrying about damaging them.

As for which boot, fit is the most important: you need to be able to
keep going all day with no rubbing or discomfort. All other things
being equal I'd sooner use the Garmont than the Scarpa for relatively
light touring, but all things aren't equal and Scarpas seem to fit me
better. Not tried the Crispi touring boot, but same general principle
of "get the one that fits" would prevail.

Pete.
--
Peter Clinch University of Dundee
Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Medical Physics, Ninewells Hospital
Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK
net http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/

  #6  
Old September 17th 03, 11:53 AM
Nick Branch
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I agree with Peter's comments about the superiority of NNN bc for 'kick and
stick' (like that) but it reminded me that you said little about the
downhill performance you seek. If you are tele turning on the way down, then
the cables will afford significant improvement in turn initiation and
control. I don't know if there is currently any cable set up for the NNN bc.
Which capability do you want to emphasize, kick and stick or downhill
control?
"Shelley" wrote in message
...
I would like to hear what folks have to say about the Exercursion vs. the
Scarpa T4 vs. the Crispi CXT. I have a pair of Fischer Boundless skis with

a
Voile 3 pin binding and am looking to upgrade my boots to either the
Exercursions,T4's or CXT. The last few years I was using the Alpina





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  #7  
Old September 17th 03, 03:35 PM
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-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----

In article ,
Shelley wrote:
Ok, maybe 'kick&glide' wasn't the appropriate term. It could be some
snowmobile trail but mostly trail breaking over undulating terrain. Or
hopefully following someone else who is breaking trail.


_ I know exactly what you mean, the Boundless is IMHO the best
ski I've ever used for that kind of stuff. Light enough to really
cover some terrain and beefy enough to be fun on the downhills.
In 6-12 inches of light powder this ski is a BLAST.


I did get a waxless version of the Boundless but do use skins in some
steeper terrain and certain types of snow conditions. And the Voile 3 pins
have the removable hardwire cable.


- - Kicker skins work well with the waxless version of this ski.


The Karhu boot is certainly interesting looking-my one experience with
leather teley boots was a painful one and found my older Scarpa T 2's more
comfortable.


_ The Kahru boot is not really a "leather" boot, just not a
plastic hard shell boot. I think you'll need a boot with a least
one real buckle to drive these skis well, two would probably be
better. As far as plastic boots go, it's probably more important
to get the one that fits your foot shape best. I suspect the
touring difference in the boots is going to be minimal at best.


I have read the review in Back Country Ski magazine-it was informative-I was
looking for more first hand information with what folks have tried.


_ I use NNN/BC with the white hard bumpers and Alpina 2500's on
these skis and I REALLY like this combo. It's the best tour 'n'
turn compromise I've ever found. Unfortunately, nobody is making
beefy NNN/BC boots anymore. I think you can ski these skis with
system bindings like NNN/BC and X-adventure, but finding an
appropriate boot is difficult. One experiment that might be
interesting is to use a boot like the Scarpa F1 and just the
Dynafit toe.

_ Booker C. Bense


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  #8  
Old September 17th 03, 06:50 PM
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-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----

In article ,
Nick Branch wrote:
I agree with Peter's comments about the superiority of NNN bc for 'kick and
stick' (like that) but it reminded me that you said little about the
downhill performance you seek. If you are tele turning on the way down, then
the cables will afford significant improvement in turn initiation and
control. I don't know if there is currently any cable set up for the NNN bc.


_ Not for at least 4 or 5 years. Rainey Designs took over the
older design from someone in the NorthEast and made a model with
essentially a flattened superloop under the binding. It worked
great and in many ways presaged the HammerHead in that the cable
routed under the foot rather than to the side. It was a very
active binding, even more than the the superloop IMHO. It was
also very easy to use just the NNN/BC part without the cable.
The only drawback of this binding was the weight and the lack
of boots to really make the best use of it. In my own use I
found that by using the hard white bumpers, I could get nearly
the same skiing performance with a lot less weight. With a
sufficiently beefy boot and some weight loss in the binding,
I think this could be a really good rig.

_ For the currently available NNN/BC boots I think a cable would
not be as much help as you might think. If the boot is not
torsionally stiff enough to support the tension from the cable it
doesn't really help the control. If you could somehow mount
an NNN/BC toe on a plate binding like the Voile VP, that might
work with current NNN/BC boots.

_ Booker C. Bense

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  #9  
Old September 17th 03, 09:01 PM
Jonathan Shefftz
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According to the recently updated BD website, the new T3 with the
thermo-moldable liner weighs a mere 5 lb. 8 oz., which is pretty much
the same as the Excursion G-Fit (according to the Garmont
international website, since the U.S. distributor's site seems to list
only the heavier weight for the regular liner). By contrast, the T4
seems to be a budget model without the thermo-moldable liner, as it
weighs more than the T3?

Crispi now shares the dubious distinction with Lowa of being the only
companies still not using lightweight thermo-moldable liners in their
plastic backcountry skiing boots, so their CXT is very heavy for a
touring boot at 7 lb. 3 oz. (although their habit of pointlessly
listing wights for a single boot confused Backcountry magazine into
listing an impossibly low weight). Even my downhill-oriented
randonnee boots (complete with dual power straps and Raichle Flexon
tongue) weigh less than that. Swapping in one of the many available
after-market thermo-moldable liners would bring the weight down, but
also bring the price up.

BTW, anyone here ever try the Dynafit MLT? I'm intrigued by any
plastic boot that drops into the sub-five-pound range...
 




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