A Snow and ski forum. SkiBanter

If this is your first visit, be sure to check out the FAQ by clicking the link above. You may have to register before you can post: click the register link above to proceed. To start viewing messages, select the forum that you want to visit from the selection below.

Go Back   Home » SkiBanter forum » Skiing Newsgroups » Snowboarding
Site Map Home Register Authors List Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read Web Partners

Beginners Board



 
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old June 23rd 04, 09:08 AM
mick quigley
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default Beginners Board

OK - I'm the first to admit. I'm a big, fat *******.

185CM/100KG or 6'1"/220LB depending on your accent.

Skill level is beginner-low intermediate.

Intended use is freeride, the half pipe just isn't my scene.


The board I'm looking at with interest is a Supermodel 168 (second
hand) with the appropriate bindings. Probably a few years old but
seems in good condition (no gouges, scrapes, bloodstains).

From my research (ya gotta love the internet!) it seems as though the
supermodel can be a bit 'floppy' - I guess my concern is that I may
outgrow this board a bit quick.

Also, I've seen a few comments about how Burton boards in general tend
to lose what little stiffness they start out with.

Other comments are that with the Super, you should select a board
~10CMs longer than you usually use.

Questions:

1. Is this likely to be a board I can use for a while without
outgrowing it?
2. Is the 'over-flexibility' and degradation of these boards an
issue?
3. Would I be better off with some other design in a ~160ish length?
4. How would I tell the manufacture year of this board? Did the
graphics change much?


Thx,

Mick.
Ads
  #2  
Old June 23rd 04, 04:11 PM
Mike T
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default Beginners Board

185CM/100KG or 6'1"/220LB depending on your accent.
-Snip-
Other comments are that with the Super, you should select a board
~10CMs longer than you usually use.


My first board was a Supermodel 168. IMHO the largest person who should
ride that board is about 190 pounds, any heavier than that, and the rider's
weight will simpoly overpower the soft flex, and the board will be too
unstable at any kind of speed. The soft flex is good for learning on, and
if you were lighter I would in fact recommend it but IMHO you are just too
big for the Super 168. I am one of the people who has commented on Burtons
softening quickly, and I suspect that's because the two that I've owned
(Supermodel 168, Custom 160) really weren't designed for someone my weight
(over time, anywhere from 175 - 200 pounds). The main reason one needs to
size up is that the Supermodels had a little exatr length in the nose and
tail, meaning the effective edge would be more akin to something shorter.
Also, they had sidecuts more typical of a shorter board.

You might consider looking for the 173 instead of the 168. That might
support your weight better.... but first, what size are your boots?
Supermodels were pretty narrow. If you're a size 12, you'll need a wider
model.

1. Is this likely to be a board I can use for a while without
outgrowing it?


If you get it long enough, and value a cushy ride over high speed stability,
sure. If you want high speed stability, you'd need the 181 which in turn
will be too much board for you as a low-intermediate.

2. Is the 'over-flexibility' and degradation of these boards an
issue?


At your weight, probably yes. It was for me averaging out at 190 pounds.

3. Would I be better off with some other design in a ~160ish length?


IMHO most ~160ish boards will also be just a tad too small and soft for 220
pounds. For the Supermodel, look to the 173; if you are interested in other
boards, look around at various manufacturers' sites and see what's
recommended for 220 pounds and you'll get a pretty good idea. For the most
part I think you'll see that the boards are 163 and higher in length.
Stiffer boards will work for you in shorter lengths where softer board
you'll still be looking ion the higher 160s. Examples - in Burton, you're
looking at something like a Custom 166 or an Omen 170. (The Omen is a
descendant of the Supermodel, only a bit stiffer from what I hear and with a
little less nose and tail). You could probably go shorter in Salomon, which
tend to be stiffer (maybe a Forecast in the 163 ish range) or you could look
at one of the smaller manufactuers like Donek or Prior which tend to be very
sold rides, and maybe even go a little shorter. (I ride the Donek Wide 161,
and feel like it could support up to about 210 pounds pretty easily, maybe
even 220)

4. How would I tell the manufacture year of this board? Did the
graphics change much?


I *think* the serial number includes the model year. I can check my wife's
old Burtons later and get back to you on how to use it. Otherwise, yes the
graphics did change... I can identify the years w/ a picture but I don't
remember the designs well enough to give a description, sorry....

I hope this helps

Mike T


  #3  
Old June 23rd 04, 06:54 PM
Arvin Chang
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default Beginners Board

(mick quigley) wrote in message . com...
OK - I'm the first to admit. I'm a big, fat *******.
185CM/100KG or 6'1"/220LB depending on your accent.
Skill level is beginner-low intermediate.
Intended use is freeride, the half pipe just isn't my scene.

The board I'm looking at with interest is a Supermodel 168 (second
hand) with the appropriate bindings. Probably a few years old but
seems in good condition (no gouges, scrapes, bloodstains).

From my research (ya gotta love the internet!) it seems as though the
supermodel can be a bit 'floppy' - I guess my concern is that I may
outgrow this board a bit quick.


My favorite review sites

http://www.boardreviews.com
http://www.outdoorreview.com/

Always take the direct reviews with a grain of salt, especially for
people who have less than 5 years of snowboarding experience.

Also, I've seen a few comments about how Burton boards in general tend
to lose what little stiffness they start out with.

Other comments are that with the Super, you should select a board
~10CMs longer than you usually use.


I've seen the same (on both points), although more like 4-7 cm and not
10 cm.

Questions:

1. Is this likely to be a board I can use for a while without
outgrowing it?


My opinion is no I don't think you will be able to use this board for
several seasons, because the board is just too soft for you. Mike T
here was 190 lbs and found it too soft, and you are a good 30 lbs
heavier. It might be nice for you first season.

2. Is the 'over-flexibility' and degradation of these boards an
issue?


Yea, Burton boards tend to fall apart - the topsheet delams, rails
pull out, they lose their camber quickly, etc. To Burton's credit they
used to replace boards very quickly (1 year warranty), doesn't really
help you out since the board is way past warranty.

The main thing you should check with such an old board is the camber,
put the board on a flat surface base down and see if the middle of the
board is at least a cm higher than the tips. If it's not, the base had
be worn out.

3. Would I be better off with some other design in a ~160ish length?


Personally I believe so. At your weight, you should be riding a
"regular" 165cm board, not a Supermodel 168, which rides like a 160 cm
board.

4. How would I tell the manufacture year of this board? Did the
graphics change much?


It is at least 4 years old since Burton stopped making them in 2000.
BTW, you do have bindings that can take the Burton 3D pattern, right?
  #4  
Old June 26th 04, 10:12 AM
phil
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default Beginners Board

185CM/100KG or 6'1"/220LB depending on your accent.
Skill level is beginner-low intermediate.
Intended use is freeride, the half pipe just isn't my scene. [...]
The board I'm looking at with interest is a Supermodel 168


[To be read in a Lancastrian accent...]
I have one of those; it was the definitive powder board for those of
us at 62Kgs/180cm. That's bottomless powder; resort stuff you don't
need something like this. Soft tail, slightly stiffer nose, very wide.

4. How would I tell the manufacture year of this board? Did the
graphics change much?


You can tell the year from the graphics - need to know the precise
colours etc to identify it, and the different lengths were produced in
different colours
each year. Mine's a 1997 I think and it's turquoise with a wave
graphic. Describe it here or post a picture.

1. Is this likely to be a board I can use for a while without
outgrowing it?
2. Is the 'over-flexibility' and degradation of these boards an
issue?
3. Would I be better off with some other design in a ~160ish length?


My "beginner-low intermediate" days are so far away I'm not best
placed to advise, but this was the expert's powder board. I'm sure
people used them on the piste too, but I find it hard to see how
they'd be good there. The thought of carving such a board on hardpack
for example would not fill me with enthusiasm. If I can throw a 168 SM
about, then it's unlikely to have flex suitable for someone much
bigger, even if you ride slowly.

The board won't last for ever, although mine is still just as poppy as
it ever was (I retired it because modern designs are better IMHO for
deep powder). Bigger riders will kill them quicker, but you should be
able to tell by looking at the board (does it still have camber etc).

Board length's a bit like surfboard or windsurf board length: it all
depends on other factors. Look at the manufacturers' recommendations
for your mass & experience and take it from there.
  #5  
Old June 26th 04, 11:02 PM
mick quigley
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default Beginners Board

Thanks for your insights guys.

I've made my decision - i've passed up on the Supermodel for a couple
of reasons:

1. Longetivity - because I'm a F.B. and the board is 4+ yrs old, I'm
sure it will deteriorate markedly as I improve.

2. Reputation - if delamination is a bit of a known/common issue with
boards, then I'd prefer to get a new one with some kind of warranty

3. Opportunity - i've managed to cut a pretty reasonable deal on a
new K2 Eldorado - for about AUD$100 more than the 2nd hand Burton.
The Eldo's appear to share many attractive points with the Super, but
are a bit stiffer (and of course it's new :-)

Now all I have to do is wait for it to be delivered so I can practice
my face-plants. 8-D
  #6  
Old July 11th 04, 06:07 AM
Tiburon27
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default Beginners Board

As a fellow fat ******* (6'1, 230lbs+) I can tell you that on any given day
in the winter I can be found on a mid 90's Lib Tech Emma Peel 157(for
jibbin' and butterin'), a 02/03 Forum Peter Line 161 for everyday middle of
the road riding or a 01-02 Gnu Carbon Highbeam Wide for powder days. (you
accumulate boards over 15 years of riding)
The point?
Don' let a 135 lbs sales person tell you you need a 190cm+ board just so a
board won't explode under your feet the second you step on it.


  #7  
Old July 20th 04, 12:15 AM
Rick Wilson
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default Beginners Board

"Tiburon27" wrote in message
...
As a fellow fat ******* (6'1, 230lbs+) I can tell you that on any given

day
in the winter I can be found on a mid 90's Lib Tech Emma Peel 157(for
jibbin' and butterin'), a 02/03 Forum Peter Line 161 for everyday middle

of
the road riding or a 01-02 Gnu Carbon Highbeam Wide for powder days. (you
accumulate boards over 15 years of riding)
The point?
Don' let a 135 lbs sales person tell you you need a 190cm+ board just so a
board won't explode under your feet the second you step on it.


I'm another fat ******* (a bit heavier than Tiburon27) and I ride a Joyride
165. It handles like a dream and is plenty long enough to support my height
and weight.

Rick


  #9  
Old July 21st 04, 05:49 PM
Mike T
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default Beginners Board

Bad call.

The Eldorado is a piece of junk compared to the Burton Supermodel.
The Supermodel imo is one of the best boards ever built.


I respectfully disagree that he made a bad call... IMHO the Supermodel is
good for many things, but heavy people ain't one of them. The Eldo, which I
admittedly have only taken one run on several years back, did seem much
better suited to a heavier rider.







  #10  
Old July 22nd 04, 12:21 AM
Mark Andersen
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default Beginners Board

"Mike T" wrote in message . ..
Bad call.

The Eldorado is a piece of junk compared to the Burton Supermodel.
The Supermodel imo is one of the best boards ever built.


I respectfully disagree that he made a bad call... IMHO the Supermodel is
good for many things, but heavy people ain't one of them. The Eldo, which I
admittedly have only taken one run on several years back, did seem much
better suited to a heavier rider.


I respectfully agree with Mike. The Eldo is a good choice for heaver
guys. I owned a 2001 169 Eldo and still have a 181 Supermodel. The
Eldo I would ride in any conditions and it responded well; quite
stable on rutted groomers and tracked-out West Coast powder. I'll
only ride the 181 Super in fluffy open powder; any other conditions
and it simply doesn't have the backbone to stand up to my 185lbs.

BTW, the 169 Eldo was retired and replaced by a 170 Oxygen Shogun.
The Shogun is such a damn fine board that I bought a second as a
reserve for when I beat the first one up on early season pow days.
The Shogun is kind of a quasi-Fish/Khyber type of board. More taper
(6 or 8mm) and setback (4.5cm) than most boards and lotsa nose, but
not to the Fish/Khyber extreme.

Enjoy the Eldo!

Mark
 




Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Beyond beginner board? Dean Snowboarding 3 April 10th 04 09:14 AM
new board for the newbie ads Snowboarding 5 March 6th 04 10:51 PM
First home board WAXing. Did I do anything wrong here? ... toddjb Snowboarding 20 February 6th 04 04:23 AM
Grasshopper technique questions! Tom Snowboarding 16 February 5th 04 05:23 PM
bX "high end" board Chiono Snowboarding 3 January 12th 04 02:34 PM


All times are GMT. The time now is 12:55 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright 2004-2018 SkiBanter.
The comments are property of their posters.