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#11
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Champion kayaker killed in XC-skiing accident
"Pieter Litchfield" wrote in message . ..
Of course, if you look at a snowmobile news group, you will see questions and comments like "I wonder if he was wearing reflective clothing." In the absence of a lot of facts, or in this case, almost all of them, suggesting murder can be slanderous and irresponsible. For the sake of making both activities safer, I'd like to see someone do a "root cause analysis" of this accident and them broadcast the findings. Throwing around accusations isn't part of that process. "Terje Henriksen" wrote in message ... "John Forrest Tomlinson" skrev i melding news Seem top to me this should be called a "snowmobile accident", or perhaps just an "accident". What is the probability to hit i skier on a big lake? Seems like murder to me. -- Terje Henriksen Kirkenes Let's not throw around words like Murder, a better description would be a tragedy. Trust me, I will keep on top of this and post the facts/results of the investigations when I hear them. John |
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#12
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Champion kayaker killed in XC-skiing accident
"Griss" skrev i melding ... I agree it's a snowmobile accident, not a skiing accident. I'm not intending to be an apologist for the snow mobiler, but let's reserve judgement. Some possible explanations: Skier could have been skiing on established packed track on lake that is also (or maybe even exclusively) used by snowmobiles. Skier could have been wearing dark, non-reflector clothing. Snowmobiler could have been going at a reasonable cruising speed. From my experience driving to work in the morning, it's very tough to see kids in non-reflectorized clothing, even going very slowly it's dangerous. A collision between a machine and a skier even at a slow speed, like 20 MPH could be fatal. Of course, the skier could be completely faultless, but I'm just urging everyone not to assume the worst (and this from me who really doesn't like snowmobiles). Of course. -- Terje Henriksen Kirkenes |
#13
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Champion kayaker killed in XC-skiing accident
"John Hart" skrev i melding om... Let's not throw around words like Murder, a better description would be a tragedy. Trust me, I will keep on top of this and post the facts/results of the investigations when I hear them. In my opinion, such things should be investigated as possible murder, and not the opposite, since in our days murder often is covered as accidents. Such "tragedies"/"accidents" are often caused by people who because of their own actions and other peoples (psychologists, psychiatrists) lies, have problems with the spirit of certain living beings who have the spirit of God. It may seem strange to you, but it is my experience that satanists, nazis, certain psychologists and psychiatrists avec fartfolio kill spiritually gifted people, in other words, the devil is killing God. This has been going on through all ages. I always suspect murder in such "accidents" unless otherwise proved. A psychiatrist will probably define me as paranoid, since they will force people to think accident first an rule out murder in all cases. The WTC "accident" may never have happened if people were more paranoid. I write a lot about these things in norwegian newsgroups, but this and further discussion is off topic in this group. I would just give you a hint. BTW, the link doesn't work anymore. -- Terje Henriksen Kirkenes |
#14
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Champion kayaker killed in XC-skiing accident
If we all climb on this logic train for a moment, why not call it "suicide"
and not an "accident?" Why do we assume the snowmobiler is a "murderer" when, in fact, the skier might have been "suicidal?" I, like John Hart, would suggest we not attribute motivation to any party before the facts are known. "Terje Henriksen" wrote in message ... "John Hart" skrev i melding om... Let's not throw around words like Murder, a better description would be a tragedy. Trust me, I will keep on top of this and post the facts/results of the investigations when I hear them. In my opinion, such things should be investigated as possible murder, and not the opposite, since in our days murder often is covered as accidents. Such "tragedies"/"accidents" are often caused by people who because of their own actions and other peoples (psychologists, psychiatrists) lies, have problems with the spirit of certain living beings who have the spirit of God. It may seem strange to you, but it is my experience that satanists, nazis, certain psychologists and psychiatrists avec fartfolio kill spiritually gifted people, in other words, the devil is killing God. This has been going on through all ages. I always suspect murder in such "accidents" unless otherwise proved. A psychiatrist will probably define me as paranoid, since they will force people to think accident first an rule out murder in all cases. The WTC "accident" may never have happened if people were more paranoid. I write a lot about these things in norwegian newsgroups, but this and further discussion is off topic in this group. I would just give you a hint. BTW, the link doesn't work anymore. -- Terje Henriksen Kirkenes |
#15
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Champion kayaker killed in XC-skiing accident
On Thu, 05 Feb 2004 23:18:12 GMT, "Terje Henriksen" wrote:
"John Hart" skrev i melding . com... Let's not throw around words like Murder, a better description would be a tragedy. Trust me, I will keep on top of this and post the facts/results of the investigations when I hear them. In my opinion, such things should be investigated as possible murder, and not the opposite, since in our days murder often is covered as accidents. Such "tragedies"/"accidents" are often caused by people who because of their own actions and other peoples (psychologists, psychiatrists) lies, have problems with the spirit of certain living beings who have the spirit of God. It may seem strange to you, but it is my experience that satanists, nazis, certain psychologists and psychiatrists avec fartfolio kill spiritually gifted people, in other words, the devil is killing God. This has been going on through all ages. I always suspect murder in such "accidents" unless otherwise proved. A psychiatrist will probably define me as paranoid, since they will force people to think accident first an rule out murder in all cases. The WTC "accident" may never have happened if people were more paranoid. I write a lot about these things in norwegian newsgroups, but this and further discussion is off topic in this group. I would just give you a hint. BTW, the link doesn't work anymore. What do they call "trolling" in the norwegian newsgroups? Ben |
#16
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Champion kayaker killed in XC-skiing accident
"Pieter Litchfield" skrev i melding news If we all climb on this logic train for a moment, why not call it "suicide" and not an "accident?" Why do we assume the snowmobiler is a "murderer" when, in fact, the skier might have been "suicidal?" What looks like suicide might also be murder. I, like John Hart, would suggest we not attribute motivation to any party before the facts are known. Yes, but by not assuming the obvious and investigate with all possibilities in mind, one might find the right solution and not only the one someone want you to think is the right one. By assuming accidents, you may not find the correct solution. The obvious is not always the solution. It is a bad principle these days because murderers hide murder as accidents or suicide. -- Terje Henriksen Kirkenes |
#17
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Champion kayaker killed in XC-skiing accident
"Ben Kaufman" skrev i melding ... What do they call "trolling" in the norwegian newsgroups? "Troll" is a norwegian word. -- Terje Henriksen Kirkenes |
#18
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Champion kayaker killed in XC-skiing accident
My point was that assuming "murder" (by defintion) casts the blame on one
party and only one party. You can't run an investigation by assuming a specific person is at fault. That's for the facts to reveal. In some jurisdiction, any unexplained death is assumed to be (and labelled as) "foul play" or "murder." This allows the police to keep an open case file forever, even if there was no specific evidence of foul play. Clearly this is not the case here. We know the cause of death. We know the cast of characters. So we can't argue that labelling the event "murder" is only for the purpose of keeping a file open on an unexplained death. "Murder" by defintion implies some motivation, however fleeting, to cause harm. That is a big leap unsupported by anything but the poster's emotional reaction to the event. "Manslaughter" or "vehiclular homicide" would better describe the circumstances where operator behavior, but NOT intent, caused harm. For example, operating a snowmobile at a very high speed in the dark in a crowded place or on an x-c ski trail would qualify, I think. I am NOT arguing that this was the case here. But it cannot be labelled as murder without evidence that there was some pre-existing motivation to cause harm. "Terje Henriksen" wrote in message ... "Pieter Litchfield" skrev i melding news If we all climb on this logic train for a moment, why not call it "suicide" and not an "accident?" Why do we assume the snowmobiler is a "murderer" when, in fact, the skier might have been "suicidal?" What looks like suicide might also be murder. I, like John Hart, would suggest we not attribute motivation to any party before the facts are known. Yes, but by not assuming the obvious and investigate with all possibilities in mind, one might find the right solution and not only the one someone want you to think is the right one. By assuming accidents, you may not find the correct solution. The obvious is not always the solution. It is a bad principle these days because murderers hide murder as accidents or suicide. -- Terje Henriksen Kirkenes |
#19
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Champion kayaker killed in XC-skiing accident
"Pieter Litchfield" skrev i melding ... My point was that assuming "murder" (by defintion) casts the blame on one party and only one party. No. You can't run an investigation by assuming a specific person is at fault. That's for the facts to reveal. Yes. But you have to find all the facts, not only a few. In some jurisdiction, any unexplained death is assumed to be (and labelled as) "foul play" or "murder." This allows the police to keep an open case file forever, even if there was no specific evidence of foul play. Yes. Clearly this is not the case here. We know the cause of death. We know the cast of characters. So we can't argue that labelling the event "murder" is only for the purpose of keeping a file open on an unexplained death. Yes we can. We can also watch the victim and understand that this is a person that nazis and worshippers of the devil would kill. "Murder" by defintion implies some motivation, however fleeting, to cause harm. Yes, and we have to find them. That is a big leap unsupported by anything but the poster's emotional reaction to the event. Experienced reaction. "Manslaughter" or "vehiclular homicide" would better describe the circumstances where operator behavior, but NOT intent, caused harm. All things should be taken into consideration, also the past of the driver of the vehicle, his interests, his connections, his reactions to people like the one he just killed etc. And also the victims last words during the weeks before the accident. Has he told someone some dangerous secrets? Did he come to near the truth about some people and their doings? For example, operating a snowmobile at a very high speed in the dark in a crowded place or on an x-c ski trail would qualify, I think. I am NOT arguing that this was the case here. But it cannot be labelled as murder without evidence that there was some pre-existing motivation to cause harm. No, it must be investigated as possible murder; not labelled. One must also envestigate how what seem like accidents or suicide could be murder. How do the murderers make the murder look like something else. In this special case, I will still consider it as murder, because the person who was killed would be a problem for people who have problem with the spirit of God. Among them are psychologists and psychiatrists, satanists and nazis. -- Terje Henriksen Kirkenes |
#20
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Champion kayaker killed in XC-skiing accident
On Fri, 13 Feb 2004 03:16:20 GMT, "Terje Henriksen" wrote:
In this special case, I will still consider it as murder, because the person who was killed would be a problem for people who have problem with the spirit of God. Among them are psychologists and psychiatrists, satanists and nazis. TROLL-O-METER |---------| | 10 | | 9 | | 8 | | 7 | | 6 | | 5 | | 4 | | 3 | |-2 | | 1 | | 0 | |---------| Hey, thanks for playing. Better luck next time. |
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