Stupid helmet question ...

In message
"pg" wrote:

[snip]
Going off on a slight tangent, I lunched at the Chalets de l'Arc in
Arc 2000 end of December. The upper restaurant suddenly filled with
Fresh Trackers across from La Plagne for the day. Weeks since
significant snowfall, avalanche risk 1, off piste virtually
impossible, it was just a touch amusing when the whole group stripped
off jackets in the steamy atmosphere to reveal matching yellow
strapped Arvas, all flashing away throughout the meal. I managed to
avoid asking whether they feared being buried under an avalanche of
tartiflette ;-) The local French thought it was hilarious. Ah, ces
rosbifs.

Understood from one of the group that it is now compulsory on certain
holidays, irrespective of the conditions/practicability of off-piste?

Pete
http://mysnowsports.com


Whilst I wouldn't always wear my transceiver, I do generally try and get
into the habit of putting it on most days I go skiing. I put in a fresh
set of batteries at the beginning of each of my trips and they then
last more than the one or two weeks of use. After the trip the partially
used batteries are transferred to less critical use.

With things like transceivers and also carrying shovel and probes, it
seems to me to be better to get into the habit of carrying them
sometimes when not needed rather than forgetting them occasionally when
they are.

Mike
--
o/ \\ // |\ ,_ o Mike Clark
\__,\\ // __o | \ / /\, "A mountain climbing, cycling, skiing,
" || _`\,_ |__\ \ | immunology lecturer, antibody engineer and
` || (_)/ (_) | \corn computer user"

On Thu, 18 Jan 2007 11:49:44 GMT, Mike Clark
wrote:


Whilst I wouldn't always wear my transceiver, I do generally try and get
into the habit of putting it on most days I go skiing.

For me it's part of getting dressed in the morning.

I put in a fresh
set of batteries at the beginning of each of my trips and they then
last more than the one or two weeks of use. After the trip the partially
used batteries are transferred to less critical use.

I'm surprised. I find that one set of batteries lasts me a whole
season, of ~50 days' use. Of course, I'll check the power levels
frequently and carry a spare set, but I've never had to change them
mid-season.

With things like transceivers and also carrying shovel and probes, it
seems to me to be better to get into the habit of carrying them
sometimes when not needed rather than forgetting them occasionally when
they are.

*ding*
--
Ace (brucedotrogers a.t rochedotcom)
Ski Club of Great Britain - http://www.skiclub.co.uk
All opinions expressed are personal and in no way represent those of the Ski Club.

Ace wrote:
On Thu, 18 Jan 2007 10:30:20 -0000, "MoonMan"
wrote:

Ace wrote:
On Wed, 17 Jan 2007 21:26:41 GMT, Pip Luscher
wrote:

ISTR that it's called "risk compensation" and I'm very aware of it
when riding a motorbike. If I'm wearing full leathers as opposed
to, say, jacket and jeans, I ride a lot faster (for relative
values of fast), especially round corners.

Indeed, and it's a basic human reaction - the safer we feel, the
more likely we are to take risks. Even being aware of it doesn't
stop you doing it.

But as I said above, a helmet doesn't make me feel safer (apart from
my chin guard and slalom poles that is),

Ask the question the other way round, then. Would you feel _less_ safe
if you were skiing without a helmet?

Free skiing - I only wear my helmet if the weathers bad, so no it makes no
difference
Slalom - I skied a run at our internal club race the other week without my
helmet, and didn't realise until I was told off (rightly) by most of the
teenagers present and my time wasn't significanntly slower. so I don't see
much difference there.
GS - never skied GS without a helmet so don't know
Sking through rocks usually more worried about my bases.



I've never ridden a Motorbike on the road
without a helmet so I don't know any different in that case,

I always wear a helmet, of course. But when I don't, same as if I'm
riding in shorts and T-shirt, I'm very much aware of how much more
vulnerable I am in the event of a spill.

and I tend not
to wear my pushbike helmet because it's uncomfortable and I can't
see much benefit, I certainly don't think a push bike helmet would
protect me from much more than cuts and graizes.


Actually I've just remembered, Lats year In thetford forest on the "black"
bike trail, I had an argument with the ground in one of the "bomb holes",
bit my lip quite badly and cut my forehead. After that I decided that if I
was going to do that again i'd wear my ski helmet with its chin guard,
rather than the useless expanded foam bike helmet that just sits on top of
your head.

Well quite. That pretty much mirrors my view of ski helmets.

Well I have to wear one for racing/training, and I much prefer it in bad
weather to a hat.

I get to ski snow in 10 days if there's any left


--

--
Chris *:-)

On Wed, 17 Jan 2007 22:42:57 +0100, Ace wrote:

On Wed, 17 Jan 2007 21:26:41 GMT, Pip Luscher
wrote:

On Wed, 17 Jan 2007 18:06:10 -0000, "MoonMan"
wrote:

I don't understand this "reckless behavior to compensate for feeling safer"
idea, why should a helmet make you feel safer?

ISTR that it's called "risk compensation" and I'm very aware of it
when riding a motorbike. If I'm wearing full leathers as opposed to,
say, jacket and jeans, I ride a lot faster (for relative values of
fast), especially round corners.

Indeed, and it's a basic human reaction - the safer we feel, the more
likely we are to take risks. Even being aware of it doesn't stop you
doing it.

I did *once* take a helmet on a skiing trip, and that was last year
when I also took a back protector because I wanted to go boarding in a
snow park. The reason I took this kit was to deliberately increase my
confidence in my first very cautious attempt in a half-pipe.

I don't recall you using it though. Or was that later?

I didn't use it at Alpe d'Huez, only the following week when I went
boarding in the big snowpark beside the Plattieres gondola out of
Mottaret.

It worked, slightly.

You did the pipe? And how was it?

Well, the protective gear worked in that I actually went into the
pipe! It was a novice pipe, so not too steep. I managed to wobble down
it a few times without falling over, but didn't actually get any air
or even right to the top edges. I found that I do need to be more
confident at riding fakie and switching stance. Won't hapen this year,
though: I'll just be skiing the one week.

Wish I'd done a few more runs, TBH, but there was so much else I
wanted to do that week, and the weather wasn't always kind, with days
of snow & fog.

Another problem was that, after each run, I either had to ride down to
a slow chair that took me some way above the park, or clamber up the
hill alongside the pipe, which was remarkably hard work; I was
absolutely gasping when I got to the top. The park could do with its
own drag lift, I reckon.

--
-Pip

In message
Ace wrote:

On Thu, 18 Jan 2007 11:49:44 GMT, Mike Clark
wrote:


Whilst I wouldn't always wear my transceiver, I do generally try and get
into the habit of putting it on most days I go skiing.

For me it's part of getting dressed in the morning.

Same here. The transceiver, googles, hats and gloves are normally
sitting together with my rucksack which also contains probe and shovel.
They all get collected together.


I put in a fresh set of batteries at the beginning of each of my
trips and they then last more than the one or two weeks of use.
After the trip the partially used batteries are transferred to less
critical use.

I'm surprised. I find that one set of batteries lasts me a whole
season, of ~50 days' use. Of course, I'll check the power levels
frequently and carry a spare set, but I've never had to change them
mid-season.

I'm not saying that the batteries wouldn't last, it's just that I prefer
to start each trip with a fresh set and the partially used ones are
perfectly OK for things such as powering domestic appliances.

Mike
--
o/ \\ // |\ ,_ o Mike Clark
\__,\\ // __o | \ / /\, "A mountain climbing, cycling, skiing,
" || _`\,_ |__\ \ | immunology lecturer, antibody engineer and
` || (_)/ (_) | \corn computer user"

In message
"MoonMan" wrote:

[snip]
I don't understand this "reckless behavior to compensate for feeling
safer" idea, why should a helmet make you feel safer? I am just as
loath to hit the ground wether I have my helmet (or other
padding/protection for that matter) on or not. I don't know about
anyone else, but when I'm about to hit the ground I don't have time
to think about what I'm wearing.

You might like to take a look at this overview article on "risk
compensation" or as it is referred to in this article as "risk
homeostasis theory".

http://ip.bmj.com/cgi/content/full/4/2/89

Mike
--
o/ \\ // |\ ,_ o Mike Clark
\__,\\ // __o | \ / /\, "A mountain climbing, cycling, skiing,
" || _`\,_ |__\ \ | immunology lecturer, antibody engineer and
` || (_)/ (_) | \corn computer user"

On Wed, 17 Jan 2007 16:38:12 GMT, "Matt T"
allegedly wrote:

It's the decreased hearing and peripheral vision I'm not keen on.

I tend to wear goggles all the time anyway as my eyes water like hell if
I've just got sunglasses on. Wearing my Boeri helmet has no effect on the
vision, as the goggles fit like a charm.

There is a small decrease in sound levels reaching the ears, but it's
hardly anything.

"Ace" wrote in message
...
| On Thu, 18 Jan 2007 06:47:18 +0100, "pg"
| wrote:
|
|
| "Ace" wrote in message
| .. .
|
| | The Ski Club has made it a rule that all children on Ski
Freshtracks
| | holidays should wear [helmets]
|
| Going off on a slight tangent, I lunched at the Chalets de l'Arc in
Arc
| 2000 end of December. The upper restaurant suddenly filled with Fresh
| Trackers across from La Plagne for the day. Weeks since significant
| snowfall, avalanche risk 1, off piste virtually impossible, it was
just
| a touch amusing when the whole group stripped off jackets in the
steamy
| atmosphere to reveal matching yellow strapped Arvas, all flashing
away
| throughout the meal. I managed to avoid asking whether they feared
being
| buried under an avalanche of tartiflette ;-) The local French thought
it
| was hilarious. Ah, ces rosbifs.
|
| Understood from one of the group that it is now compulsory on certain
| holidays, irrespective of the conditions/practicability of off-piste?
|
| It's compulsory for any off-piste excursion, at any time, and it's
| also compulsory for everyone on all Ski Freshtracks holidays on- or
| off-piste.
|
| Some may laugh, but there are several reasons for it, including:
| 1. We see it as much as an educational thing as a short-term dafety
| issue - getting punters to be aware that there is always a risk and
| that we should always do what we can to minimise it is a lesson worth
| teaching.
| 2. Dunno about you, but I've seen avalanches occuring in Risk 1
| conditions - 1 doesn't mean no risk at all, just that it's the lowest
| measure used.
| 3. If you don't wear your ARVA every day, how do you make a decision
| as to which days to wear it? I've even known people who don't put it
| on but carry it (not switched on) in their rucksack 'just in case'.
| How stupid is that?
| 4. We have to cart the things out to the resort with us, so we're damn
| well gonna make the punters wear them ;-)
|
| So some folk may laugh, but do we care? Do we 'eck, as like.



Still, given that they were spending the whole day entirely on piste or
pottering around the edges, with off piste a few crusty centimetres of
hard snow/ice inbetween the rocks, a whole restaurant full of flashing
transceivers and proudly worn matching yellow straps just
looked...well... funny. I reckon I would have kept my jacket on,
whatever the temperature in the restaurant ...

In message
"pg" wrote:

[snip]
Still, given that they were spending the whole day entirely on piste

It's not unknown of for an avalanche to cross a piste.

Mike
--
o/ \\ // |\ ,_ o Mike Clark
\__,\\ // __o | \ / /\, "A mountain climbing, cycling, skiing,
" || _`\,_ |__\ \ | immunology lecturer, antibody engineer and
` || (_)/ (_) | \corn computer user"

On Thu, 18 Jan 2007 11:49:44 GMT, Mike Clark
allegedly wrote:

Whilst I wouldn't always wear my transceiver, I do generally try and get
into the habit of putting it on most days I go skiing. I put in a fresh
set of batteries at the beginning of each of my trips and they then
last more than the one or two weeks of use. After the trip the partially
used batteries are transferred to less critical use.

With things like transceivers and also carrying shovel and probes, it
seems to me to be better to get into the habit of carrying them
sometimes when not needed rather than forgetting them occasionally when
they are.

This is my take on it completely, including battery rotation.