Serious reviews/discussion of Day Touring gear?

On Thu, 10 Jan 2008 06:18:31 -0800 (PST), "Jeff Potter (of
OutYourBackdoor.com)" wrote:

We can't let
people hide insults under the umbrella of criticism. It'll turn this
NG into a ghost-town.

Below is the entirety of my first post in this thread, that set this
thing off. If you think what I wrote below is an insult you've got
way too thin a skin and actually should stop posting until you can
handle criticism better.


=============
On Wed, 19 Dec 2007 09:42:49 -0800 (PST),
"Jeff Potter (of OutYourBackdoor.com)"
wrote:

I would think that the vast majority of skiers might find such info to
be helpful and interesting, as it's the vast majority of skiing.

You've got a logical problem if one one hand
you talk about the vast majority and
on the other you've got idiosyncratic views of what
is right to use - views that don't agree with that
people would buy now.
============

Pointing out a flaw in your logic is not an insult. Pointing out that
you may often have flaws in your logic may be insulting but it is
factual.

If you want to argue with my claims, let's have a real substantive
discussion. But if you just say I'm flaming you, insulting you, etc
you're way off and hiding behind a shield of "netiquette" and, as I
said to Romat, I don't play that.

So stop trying to shut me up with that appeal to non-insults. If you
want to shut me up, prove me wrong. Make some well-supported
statements that show you actually have needs in common with lots of
other people. That your'e not idiosyncratic. Read what I quote above
and let's talk substance. It would be interesting.

On Jan 10, 10:53 am, John Forrest Tomlinson
wrote:
On Thu, 10 Jan 2008 06:18:31 -0800 (PST), "Jeff Potter (of

OutYourBackdoor.com)" wrote:
We can't let
people hide insults under the umbrella of criticism. It'll turn this
NG into a ghost-town.

Below is the entirety of my first post in this thread, that set this
thing off. If you think what I wrote below is an insult you've got
way too thin a skin and actually should stop posting until you can
handle criticism better.

I didn't exactly say that was insulting.

Anyone who wanted to could see that when you launch into insults (in
that and many other threads) is when I call you on them.

I post normal, constructive things and you give insulting replies that
hurts the NG. So please desist. Hopefully nobody bothers to read the
end posts of the old thread or this thread---they don't give a great
signal-noise picture of the NG---but neither do many of your insulting
kneejerk replies.

--JP

On Jan 10, 10:42 am, John Forrest Tomlinson
wrote:
On Thu, 10 Jan 2008 06:18:31 -0800 (PST), "Jeff Potter (of

OutYourBackdoor.com)" wrote:

If JFT, or whoever, flames me I'm going to call it out.

If JP or whoever writes silly stuff I'm going to call it out.

Just skip the insults.

On and on.

It stops with netiquette. It really does. Every time. In every
newsgroup I've seen. Netiquette does wonders.

On Fri, 11 Jan 2008 11:13:15 -0800 (PST), "Jeff Potter (of
OutYourBackdoor.com)" wrote:

I post normal, constructive things and you give insulting replies that
hurts the NG.

Your stuff tries to be constructive, but sometimes it's ill-conceived
and wrong. I point that out, you get huffy and things deteriorate for
there.

Just think more critically before you start your posts and this
wouldn't happen.

"John Forrest Tomlinson" wrote in message
...
On Fri, 11 Jan 2008 11:13:15 -0800 (PST), "Jeff Potter (of
OutYourBackdoor.com)" wrote:

I post normal, constructive things and you give insulting replies that
hurts the NG.

Your stuff tries to be constructive, but sometimes it's ill-conceived
and wrong. I point that out, you get huffy and things deteriorate for
there.

Just think more critically before you start your posts and this
wouldn't happen.


help me with this one. should one review their new low cut touring ski
boots before or after one finds out they're the wrong size?

On Jan 13, 7:33 am, "TM" wrote:
"John Forrest Tomlinson" wrote in messagenews:nj2go35n41s221emdarrj8dvsqfj7jfusa@4ax .com...

On Fri, 11 Jan 2008 11:13:15 -0800 (PST), "Jeff Potter (of
OutYourBackdoor.com)" wrote:

I post normal, constructive things and you give insulting replies that
hurts the NG.

Your stuff tries to be constructive, but sometimes it's ill-conceived
and wrong. I point that out, you get huffy and things deteriorate for
there.

Nope. My only complaint is when you stoop to insults---it can't be
good for the NG. The rest of your comments I usually just refute.

Just think more critically before you start your posts and this
wouldn't happen.

Nope. If you replied according to netiquette it wouldn't happen.

help me with this one. should one review their new low cut touring ski
boots before or after one finds out they're the wrong size?

Ha... My post about the only quality lowcut boots on the market (and
on clearance) wasn't a review but a notice and a description based on
what I've seen so far. My size discovery is also of interest: that
these boots are very wide---a wrong width for me is happy news for
others. Anyone looking for lowcut or wide boots would likely find my
post to be far more helpful than yours, don't you think?

--JP

In article ,
Jeff Potter (of OutYourBackdoor.com) wrote:
Nope. My only complaint is when you stoop to insults---it can't be
good for the NG.

That doesn't mean that it's bad for the newsgroup, of
course. The only post I've seen recently that bugged me at
all was the one in this thread with the juvenile sexist crap
- mostly I just don't care whether or not somebody is
insulting somebody else. Obviously people's tolerances vary
quite a bit, and it's probably in the best Usenet tradition
to take responsibility for what you read and filter, filter,
filter.

obWhatever: AP put out an article on a recent study
quantifying changes in winter in the northeastern US over
the past 40 years. Read it and weep:

A study of weather station data from across the
Northeast from 1965 through 2005 found December-March
temperatures increased by 2.5 degrees. Snowfall totals
dropped by an average of 8.8 inches across the region
over the same period, and the number of days with at
least 1 inch of snow on the ground decreased by nine
days on average.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/22625211/
--
Melinda Shore - Software longa, hardware brevis -

Prouder than ever to be a member of the reality-based community

Anyone else thinking this sounds a lot like this?

http://www.mindspring.com/~mfpatton/sketch.htm

On Sun, 13 Jan 2008 17:40:50 -0800 (PST), Camilo
wrote:

Anyone else thinking this sounds a lot like this?

http://www.mindspring.com/~mfpatton/sketch.htm

Yeah, but there is some substance to the argument we've had. Jeff
believes that he can say what he like and I can' t point out errors in
this thinking unless I add positive or related information. I think
pointing our errors has value in itself. It's a fundamental
disagreement about the nature of public discussion.

John Forrest Tomlinson wrote:

I think pointing our errors has value in itself. It's a
fundamental disagreement about the nature of public discussion.

No it's not.