Boot Info and Basic Tuning Needed

Hello,
This is my first time posting to this group. I have been skiing for
years, but I never had decent equipment until last season. I finally threw
away my old Rossignol Quantum's (the guy at the ski shop said that they were
so old they were a liability). I gave in, knowing it was time to let go. I
wound up buying a pair of Volkl EnergY's and Nordica Boots.

Question 1
On the Nordica boots, they are F8's with the "Slide In" Feature. Once my
foot is in the boot there is a big Gray piece of plastic attached to the
outside of the boot that wraps around the front of the foot. Is it supposed
to go "Directly" under the plastic on the other side or should it fit under
the second piece of plastic on the same side? Make Sense? If not check out
the pictures and let me know if it shoudl be Pic 1 or Pic 2. In Pic 2
notice the wear that the plastic piece causes if in the other position (pic
1). Click on either picture to enlarge.

http://www.imageevent.com/metalunna/skis

Question 2:
I want to maintain my skis as best I can. I bought a Gummi Stone and an
Swix Edger.

What is the best way to use the Stone and edger? Should I take the stone
and lay it along the side of the ski and move it up and down along the
"Dinged" areas. Should I Lay it on the base?

For the edger, what results should I expect? SHould I get a razor edge or
just a clean edge? I tried a run through on my old Rossi's but didnt get
too much of a result.

Also, What is the easiest way to tell the bevel angle on my skis. I bought
them new from a shop and told them I am an intermediate skill and will be
skiing on the east coast on mostly hard snow.
This description is pointing to a 2 degree bevel but I want to make sure so
that I use the correct setting on the edger. I called the shop to see if
the same guy was there, hoping I could see what he would have used but he
was not there.

Thanks for taking the time to read

Nick

Nick wrote:

Hello,
This is my first time posting to this group. I have been skiing for
years, but I never had decent equipment until last season. I finally threw
away my old Rossignol Quantum's (the guy at the ski shop said that they were
so old they were a liability). I gave in, knowing it was time to let go. I
wound up buying a pair of Volkl EnergY's and Nordica Boots.

Question 1
On the Nordica boots, they are F8's with the "Slide In" Feature. Once my
foot is in the boot there is a big Gray piece of plastic attached to the
outside of the boot that wraps around the front of the foot. Is it supposed
to go "Directly" under the plastic on the other side or should it fit under
the second piece of plastic on the same side? Make Sense? If not check out
the pictures and let me know if it shoudl be Pic 1 or Pic 2. In Pic 2
notice the wear that the plastic piece causes if in the other position (pic
1). Click on either picture to enlarge.

http://www.imageevent.com/metalunna/skis

Interesting. I'm totally unfamiliar with these bootst. Maybe someone
else knows these boots? I'd say hight thee to your shop and ask them.
You need to keep a relationaship with them anyway, so they can adjust
the boots if you develop any pressure points or loseness.

Question 2:
I want to maintain my skis as best I can. I bought a Gummi Stone and an
Swix Edger.

What is the best way to use the Stone and edger? Should I take the stone
and lay it along the side of the ski and move it up and down along the
"Dinged" areas. Should I Lay it on the base?

A Gummi stone is for de-tuning the tips (dulling the shovel and tails
for a few inches to avoid hooking a tip. A gummi won't do a thing to
sharpen the skis; a gummi can only dull edges due to its softness.
Sometimes a good hand can use a gummi to smooth the edge AFTER you
sharpen them but it's hard to avoid dulling them while trying. A small
sharpening stone is useful to take out dings and polish the edges
between full filing sessions.

For the edger, what results should I expect? SHould I get a razor edge or
just a clean edge? I tried a run through on my old Rossi's but didnt get
too much of a result.

That's an excellant idea - practice on your old ski repeatedly.

Dozens of "edge tools" are made and sold each year - I'm sorry to say
most are hype. Some of them actually get used. A good mill ******* file
is all you really need. Sometimes a length of right angle aluminum (and
clamp to hold the file to the angle) is useful for side wall sharpening.
A wrap of masking tape around the file placed flat on the bases with the
tape over one edge will bevel the other edge about a degree; repeat for
opposite side. File the side edges slightly acute freehand or using the
angle.

Commendations on wanting to do your own work. You really need a good
book on ski maintenance. I used to recommend Seth Masia's book "Alpine
Ski Maintenance and Repair" but he says it's out of print - maybe you
can find a copy somewhere. It's a good basics book. Or try the tuning
web sites like Tognar's http://www.tognar.com/volkl.html

Tognar sales a bunch of tuning stuff, and books and videos. Good
resource. BTW, you also need an old clothes iron and some wax.

Enjoy your skis, but don't worry too much - they're meant to be used to
eventual destruction. The goal is to spend 100 days skiing them to death
in the next few years. Have fun.


Also, What is the easiest way to tell the bevel angle on my skis. I bought
them new from a shop and told them I am an intermediate skill and will be
skiing on the east coast on mostly hard snow.
This description is pointing to a 2 degree bevel but I want to make sure so
that I use the correct setting on the edger. I called the shop to see if
the same guy was there, hoping I could see what he would have used but he
was not there.

Thanks for taking the time to read

Nick

Thank you so much for the tips. Im glad that I didnt use the gummi on my
real skis!

I'll try some of the links you gave. I actually went to Barnes and Noble
today while I was on the highway, but I couldnt find anything. The
salesperson just looked at me funny. Ha.

Thanks again,
Nick
"lal_truckee" wrote in message
...
Nick wrote:

Hello,
This is my first time posting to this group. I have been skiing for
years, but I never had decent equipment until last season. I finally
threw
away my old Rossignol Quantum's (the guy at the ski shop said that they
were
so old they were a liability). I gave in, knowing it was time to let
go. I
wound up buying a pair of Volkl EnergY's and Nordica Boots.

Question 1
On the Nordica boots, they are F8's with the "Slide In" Feature. Once
my
foot is in the boot there is a big Gray piece of plastic attached to
the
outside of the boot that wraps around the front of the foot. Is it
supposed
to go "Directly" under the plastic on the other side or should it fit
under
the second piece of plastic on the same side? Make Sense? If not check
out
the pictures and let me know if it shoudl be Pic 1 or Pic 2. In Pic 2
notice the wear that the plastic piece causes if in the other position
(pic
1). Click on either picture to enlarge.

http://www.imageevent.com/metalunna/skis

Interesting. I'm totally unfamiliar with these bootst. Maybe someone
else knows these boots? I'd say hight thee to your shop and ask them.
You need to keep a relationaship with them anyway, so they can adjust
the boots if you develop any pressure points or loseness.

Question 2:
I want to maintain my skis as best I can. I bought a Gummi Stone and an
Swix Edger.

What is the best way to use the Stone and edger? Should I take the
stone
and lay it along the side of the ski and move it up and down along the
"Dinged" areas. Should I Lay it on the base?

A Gummi stone is for de-tuning the tips (dulling the shovel and tails
for a few inches to avoid hooking a tip. A gummi won't do a thing to
sharpen the skis; a gummi can only dull edges due to its softness.
Sometimes a good hand can use a gummi to smooth the edge AFTER you
sharpen them but it's hard to avoid dulling them while trying. A small
sharpening stone is useful to take out dings and polish the edges
between full filing sessions.

For the edger, what results should I expect? SHould I get a razor edge
or
just a clean edge? I tried a run through on my old Rossi's but didnt
get
too much of a result.

That's an excellant idea - practice on your old ski repeatedly.

Dozens of "edge tools" are made and sold each year - I'm sorry to say
most are hype. Some of them actually get used. A good mill ******* file
is all you really need. Sometimes a length of right angle aluminum (and
clamp to hold the file to the angle) is useful for side wall sharpening.
A wrap of masking tape around the file placed flat on the bases with the
tape over one edge will bevel the other edge about a degree; repeat for
opposite side. File the side edges slightly acute freehand or using the
angle.

Commendations on wanting to do your own work. You really need a good
book on ski maintenance. I used to recommend Seth Masia's book "Alpine
Ski Maintenance and Repair" but he says it's out of print - maybe you
can find a copy somewhere. It's a good basics book. Or try the tuning
web sites like Tognar's http://www.tognar.com/volkl.html

Tognar sales a bunch of tuning stuff, and books and videos. Good
resource. BTW, you also need an old clothes iron and some wax.

Enjoy your skis, but don't worry too much - they're meant to be used to
eventual destruction. The goal is to spend 100 days skiing them to death
in the next few years. Have fun.


Also, What is the easiest way to tell the bevel angle on my skis. I
bought
them new from a shop and told them I am an intermediate skill and will
be
skiing on the east coast on mostly hard snow.
This description is pointing to a 2 degree bevel but I want to make sure
so
that I use the correct setting on the edger. I called the shop to see
if
the same guy was there, hoping I could see what he would have used but
he
was not there.

Thanks for taking the time to read

Nick

lal_truckee writes:

Nick wrote:
[snip]

Question 2:
I want to maintain my skis as best I can. I bought a Gummi Stone and an
Swix Edger.

What is the best way to use the Stone and edger? Should I take the stone
and lay it along the side of the ski and move it up and down along the
"Dinged" areas. Should I Lay it on the base?

A Gummi stone is for de-tuning the tips (dulling the shovel and tails
for a few inches to avoid hooking a tip. A gummi won't do a thing to
sharpen the skis; a gummi can only dull edges due to its softness.
Sometimes a good hand can use a gummi to smooth the edge AFTER you
sharpen them but it's hard to avoid dulling them while trying. A small
sharpening stone is useful to take out dings and polish the edges
between full filing sessions.

I use a gummi to take out burrs on the hill. Other than that, like
you say, detuning.

For the edger, what results should I expect? SHould I get a razor edge or
just a clean edge? I tried a run through on my old Rossi's but didnt get
too much of a result.

That's an excellant idea - practice on your old ski repeatedly.

Dozens of "edge tools" are made and sold each year - I'm sorry to say
most are hype. Some of them actually get used. A good mill ******* file
is all you really need. Sometimes a length of right angle aluminum (and
clamp to hold the file to the angle) is useful for side wall
sharpening.

Well, yeah, particularly for a newbie. I know people who file
without a guide and get good results, but they're very experienced.
A newbie should probably have some kind of guide to keep the file
from going all over the place, IMO.

--
:::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ::::::::::::::::::::::::
Mary Malmros
Some days you're the windshield,
Other days you're the bug.

Mary Malmros wrote:


Well, yeah, particularly for a newbie. I know people who file
without a guide and get good results, but they're very experienced.
A newbie should probably have some kind of guide to keep the file
from going all over the place, IMO.

Sawed my "guide" from some alu angle. As square as my best machinist's
square; That plus a small c-clamp, a mill ******* file, some masking
tape, and you're all set to sharpen your edges with the best of them.

Of course that doesn't keep my tuning box from filling up with all kinds
of gewgaws - I'm a packrat and tool maven; but most all those doohickys
just sit in the tuning box.

"Nick" wrote in message
...
Hello,
Question 1
... If not check out
the pictures and let me know if it shoudl be Pic 1 or Pic 2.

I don't know anything about those boots other than what I can see in the
photo, but it looks like Pic 1 is correct. It *looks* like what you're
dealing with is the usual overlap of the cuff over the bottom part of the
boot. The cuff goes over the bottom part: it doesn't interdigitate with it
(if that makes sense, which is perhaps questionable).

Question 2:
I want to maintain my skis as best I can. I bought a Gummi Stone and an
Swix Edger.

What is the best way to use the Stone and edger? Should I take the stone
and lay it along the side of the ski and move it up and down along the
"Dinged" areas. Should I Lay it on the base?

In addition to detuning skis, gummi stones are often used to deburr them. If
you sharpen with a file, you leave a very small burr (little lip of metal)
poking out on the other side of the edge. That is: if you file the side of
the edge, there'll be a burr sticking out on the base side. Just leaving the
burr isn't that big a deal. Sideslipping on the snow would knock it off
anyway, I think. But if you want perfection ....

For touching up "dinged" areas, I guess it's my impression a diamond stone
would come in more handy.

For the edger, what results should I expect? SHould I get a razor edge or
just a clean edge?

You can probably get a pretty darn sharp edge, though perhaps "razor" is
overstating it. It's not like shaving with your skis is going to a good
idea. And it won't stay "razor" sharp through a lot of use. A good, clean,
reasonably sharp edge is probably sufficient for ordinary skiing.

I tried a run through on my old Rossi's but didnt get
too much of a result.

Keep working on them. If the edges are dull, it may take some work. I don't
know what sort of file is in the Swix edger.

Also, What is the easiest way to tell the bevel angle on my skis. I
bought
them new from a shop and told them I am an intermediate skill and will be
skiing on the east coast on mostly hard snow.

I don't think ski shops typically fool with the bevel when they sell skis.
They just sell them the way they come from the manufacturer.

Tognar's catalog (and, I think, their website) has some info on what bevel
variouis ski manufacturers usually use. I'll join in the suggestion above
about the Tognar catalog. Get it. In addition to lots of tools, with
descriptions, it has a bunch of tips interspersed throughout it. I think a
bunch of them are on the website too.

A good ski tuning shop could check the existing bevel for you. They could
also change it (as could you, but it's less work if they do it). It's
probably not a great idea to fool around with it a *lot* -- the only way to
change it is to remove metal, after all. If you're skiing on NE boilerplate
and really want more hold, you might consider increasing the side bevel to
sharpen the edge.

Finally, one thought on ski shops. This isn't based on through-going
research or anything, so you might take it with a grain of salt.
Anecdotally, though, there are quite a few "ski shops" (accurate, in that
they sell skis and associated merchandise) who aren't necessarily all that
competent when it comes to working on skis. You might want to ask around
among the local congnescenti for a recommendation, if you do want work done
on your skis.

lal_truckee writes:

Mary Malmros wrote:


Well, yeah, particularly for a newbie. I know people who file
without a guide and get good results, but they're very experienced.
A newbie should probably have some kind of guide to keep the file
from going all over the place, IMO.

Sawed my "guide" from some alu angle. As square as my best machinist's
square; That plus a small c-clamp, a mill ******* file, some masking
tape, and you're all set to sharpen your edges with the best of them.

Of course that doesn't keep my tuning box from filling up with all kinds
of gewgaws - I'm a packrat and tool maven; but most all those doohickys
just sit in the tuning box.

I use a Side of Beast and a Base of Beast and just put the
appropriate tool o destruction in 'em -- mill *******, diamond
stone, whatever. It's a pretty simple system. I am looking for a
quick-and-dirty solution for my rock skis when I'm on the road --
maybe I'll just freehand those.

--
:::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ::::::::::::::::::::::::
Mary Malmros
Some days you're the windshield,
Other days you're the bug.