To pole or not to pole

Bob Lee wrote:
In article .com,
"yunlong" wrote:

Bob Lee wrote:
yunlong wrote:

bdubya wrote:
yunlong wrote:
Bob Lee wrote:
If you could skate in powder or crud, or on a slope over
40
degrees, then what you wrote might not be viewed as
bull****.

I did, as flat-boarding.

Did you look like this?

Close enough, I was the chaser holding the camera.

Seemed to be skiing very slow. So, were you satisfied with
that person's skiing? Answer carefully.

Yes, as I said, if you can ski down the Upper Dynamic "shooting a
line," you'd be a hotshot already.

So why do you dismiss experts' suggestions and argue with 'hotshots'?

Actually, no real "hotshots" really argue with me, they know what I can
do; only those half-baked self-claimed experts who couldn't present a
valid argument or demonstrate what they can do, but only faking it,
"I'm the expert... you don't know how to ski..." and verbiage
ceaselessly.


A lot of people here have a lot more knowledge about skiing than you
do.

That's what I like to see it, what kind of "a lot more knowledge about
skiing" is, care to present an argument?

What's that saying you have about arrogance?

Look deep into yourself, you may find the answer.


By the way, did you notice that the person was skiing off-balance
as
indicated by the hands and arms waving around up high?

Those were for unweighting, maybe; flat-boarding skis on a "flat
platform" which is formed by the balance of the feet, be that a
wedge,
parallel, or open stance.

Heh. You're saying the arms waving around are 'for unweighting,
maybe'?
Too funny.

Yup, in your denial.


If the hands
were held low and out in front, the skiing should improve
significantly.
And, oddly enough, a very good way to keep the hands low and in
front
in
bumps is PROPER POLE PLANTS.

There's NO "POLE PLANTS" in flat-boarding, ...

Yeah, well take it from 'hotshot' - there *should* be pole plants.
The
skiing would be better.

No, do the same thing with less equipment is better.


...hands are held in a dynamic
(not static) balance for unweighting and for expressions,

Expressions?!?

Yes.

rotfl

Silly.


The trail is Upper Dynamic, Sierra-at-Tahoe; needless to say it
is
a
"diamond run," if you can shot a line down, even with poles,
you
are a
hotshot already, however, can you do it without poles?

*Why* would you do it without poles when poles would help you
ski it easier and better?

Two reasons: 1.) as I have shown, it is not "simply" "easier and
better," the "timing" of the pole-plant alone is going to take an
average skier at least four/five seasons, if not ever, to
master/catch
up, and how to use the poles is another question, where
flat-boarding
is ready to go when one has learned to control the skis; 2.) the
main
reason, pole-planting breaks the flow of the glide, depicts a rigid
ski
sequence, and restricts the free movements of hands, and
consequently
restricts the body movements, which is less than I would like to
ski.

Utter bull****.

Do you have a reason? Or just utterly bull**** yourself.


Before you ask, I ski "diamond runs" that are harder than that
all the time in bumps, powder and crud...in tele gear.

I did that too,
http://www.taomartialarts.com/ski/ski_p_chasel6.jpg
at Breckenridge, 1985.

Uh, where is the 'diamond run', the bumps, and the crud or powder?

So you are a "single" minded, eh? Show you a picture and you think that
is all there is? Or just in denial to protect your losing face?

IS


Bob

Richard Henry wrote:
"Bob Lee" wrote in message
...
In article .com,
"yunlong" wrote:

Bob Lee wrote:

Before you ask, I ski "diamond runs" that are harder than that
all the time in bumps, powder and crud...in tele gear.

I did that too,
http://www.taomartialarts.com/ski/ski_p_chasel6.jpg
at Breckenridge, 1985.

Uh, where is the 'diamond run', the bumps, and the crud or powder?

The camera angle confuses things.

Yup, and those easterners just have no idea how "big" the
mountains/continental divide really is.


Speaking of which, I finally watched the flatboarding movie.
I think if I saw someone skiing like that I might try to help.

"Hey, man, are you ok? Did you lose your poles? Want to borrow one
of
mine?"

Yup, I get that kind of question all the times on the chairlifts; it's
funny how people really see things.


IS

"yunlong" wrote in message

boards. Seems your fellow practitioners of Tai Chi have little use or

respect for your thoughts there either.

Yup, those conceited lower characters act pretty much the same
everywhere on the net.


Your attitude, arogance, and complete inability to admit your wrong is so
totally
anti tai-chi that at this point no one here believes you have any training
in tai-chi period.
let me guess your a self taught taoist.
BWAHAHAHAHAHAHA.
BTW ALL the pix of yours show some of the worst balance and form I've ever
seen.

"VtSkier" wrote in message
...
Walt wrote:
Sven Golly wrote:

Heh. I still want to watch Itchy roll over on a 40 degree slope.


Wouldn't it be all slush at that point?

Oh, Walt are we going to get into that degree of
slope argument again?

Dontcha mean slop debate.

"Wayne Decker" wrote in message
m...
Wow! Quite a discussion.! Since I often ski without my poles--you can
probably guess how I feel. I watch people. If their body language tells
me
that they are using their poles as a security blanket--I take them away.
Once they seem to realize that skiing happens on the skiis and not the
poles
I give them back--with the caveat that if I see them creap forward--I'll
take them away again.

Are you saying you don't want their hands forward ?

LePheaux wrote:
"VtSkier" wrote in message
...

Walt wrote:

Sven Golly wrote:


Heh. I still want to watch Itchy roll over on a 40 degree slope.


Wouldn't it be all slush at that point?


Oh, Walt are we going to get into that degree of
slope argument again?


Dontcha mean slop debate.


Well, yeah, but that has to do with degrees.

"yunlong" wrote in message
oups.com...
Before you ask, I ski "diamond runs" that are harder than that
all the time in bumps, powder and crud...in tele gear.

I did that too,
http://www.taomartialarts.com/ski/ski_p_chasel6.jpg
at Breckenridge, 1985.

I've got news for you yunlong. That run is not a diamond run. I live in
Breck and can tell you without a doubt that there are no diamond runs on the
mountain where that picture could possibly be taken from. The only diamond
runs that have or had chairlifts on them at Breck are all above treeline or
face a direction where you cannot possibly get a picture looking down into
town. The trail you are on in this pic is a blue trail that gets groomed
every night. If you think I'm wrong, please provide the name of the trail
to prove me wrong. I'd be more than willing to go out and snap the same pic
as well as of the trail marker of the so called 'diamond' trail. So, some
more of you BS exposed.

BTW, both skiers in this picture and other pictures/movies are leaning so
far into to mountain that I've be supprised if you don't spend a lot of time
on your butt. What ever happened to stand up straight?

IMHO poles are very handy when skiing. They can be used as outriggers to
help maintain that center of balance in situations where your center of
gravity has gone past the point of no return if you didn't have poles. An
before you tell me that if I had ballance that wouldn't happen, let me tell
you that it happens all the time. Cases where you may hit a rock or log
buried under powder so you can't see it. Let me guess, you know where all
the rocks are before you get to them because you visualize being the rock.
Here's a better idea, learn to ski and get off the groomers one in awhile.

snoig

On 18 Jan 2005 09:02:13 -0800, "yunlong"
wrote:

bdubya wrote:
On 16 Jan 2005 19:51:07 -0800, "yunlong"
wrote:


If you could skate in powder or crud, or on a slope over 40
degrees, then what you wrote might not be viewed as bull****.

I did, as flat-boarding.

Did you look like this?

Close enough, I was the chaser holding the camera.


http://www.taomartialarts.com/ski/upperdynamic.wmv

Embarrassing.

You feel so? The angle of the camera played a joke on you.

Please; that's a really pathetic little dodge. The angle of the camer
is so erratic that it can't impart any information at all, let alone
"play a joke" on anyone. The angle of the SKIER does say a little
about the angle of the slope, but what's embarrassing is how the skier
needs to traverse most of the slope to recover (because he/she is in
the backseat); once the slope eases (at the end of the video), the
skier manages to link a few turns, but up higher, it's just not
happening due to the lousy form.


The trail is Upper Dynamic, Sierra-at-Tahoe; needless to say it is a
"diamond run," if you can shot a line down, even with poles, you are a
hotshot already, however, can you do it without poles?

I'm not sure what you mean by "shot a line", but while I'm no hotshot,
I could definitely ski that run with much less effort than your
student is putting forth.

Let me put it this way: the skiing I see in your videos takes me way
back, to my first trip west, as an unschooled, inexperienced
17-year-old in Snowmass. On that trip, since I had never had any
lessons, I was making things up as I went along, and the survival
techniques that I stumbled upon are all on clear display in your
videos. Not working the edges on the groomed, and pushing the tails
out to make the turns. Flailing down the bumps, unable to link a
turn - your "upperdynamic" video could be a clip from my first run
down the double-black Lower Powderhorn, except that I was carrying
poles. (I had no use for them because I was so far back, but I was
carrying them.) The slow spins on the flats, occasionally pausing to
ski backwards for a few turns. I've been there. Even riding the
tails in order to survive the powder (which you have advocated in the
past, IIRC).

I'm not saying there's anything inherently wrong or evil about skiing
like this; I enjoyed that trip immensely, I'm sure you enjoy your
skiing as well, and I figure your students are enjoying themselves as
well. But those techniques, or habits, are inherently limiting; when
I wanted to explore a little more of the mountain (steeper runs,
off-piste, etc), I had to unlearn them all, and learn a more orthodox
style which unlocked vast terrain I couldn't access before. Based on
your comments about "off-piste", I suspect you're in the same
dead-end. If your pride won't allow you to see the wall you've walked
into, that's your problem, and although I think it's a shame that
you're charging people to be led into the same cul-de-sac, I'm sure
that those who wish to go farther will find their way out the same way
I did. And maybe someday you will as well.

Best of luck to you,
bw

On Tue, 18 Jan 2005 20:24:05 GMT, uglymoney
wrote:

On Tue, 18 Jan 2005 11:20:16 -0500, Walt
wrote:

BTW, how was bahemya?

Yes, I am curious as well. I considered it, but had to work
yesterday. 550 miles is a long ways for a short weekend.

We had a north wind here, cold and dry. Did that pull any moisture
off the lake?

Some, but not as much as forecast. You had to go fairly deep into the
trees to link a few turns of untracked, but it could be found. Of
course, I managed to find a line that was too tight for me (I'm just
not man enough to wrestle those 190s around that quick), but the
shoulder's feeling much better today......the more accessible areas,
were cut-up, but far from skied-out, and the snow was REAL light by MW
standards. Even the frontside runs were soft, where they usually get
some icy spots up top. Saturday was pretty crisp (high was maybe 2
degF, +/-) with a consistent light snow coming down . We actually saw
the sun for a while on Sunday, and temps might have hit 10 or so.
Crowds were about what I expected; there were two times that we
actually had to wait behind somebody else before we could load, but
other than that it was ski up and sit right down.

But boy, it's a long drive. We're headed back for Prezdets' weekend,
but might overnight somewhere along the way for a change.

bw

bdubya reminisced:

Let me put it this way: the skiing I see in your videos takes me way
back, to my first trip west, as an unschooled, inexperienced
17-year-old in Snowmass....

Best of luck to you,

Nice exposition. You do realize, however, that you'd probably be more
successful trying to explain the Nimzo-Indian defense to a spoon.

--
//-Walt
//
// There is no Völkl Conspiracy