Nitro Darkhorse, Shogun, Naturals....

Has anyone tried these boards yet? Can you tell me which board is
stiffest out of the three?

I heard Shogun's are stiffer than Naturals but when I tried shoguns
last year, I thought Naturals was stiffer than Shogun...and I haven't
tried Darkhorse yet. I want one of these boards for high speed
freeriding/carving. Thanks alot.

I heard Shogun's are stiffer than Naturals but when I tried shoguns
last year, I thought Naturals was stiffer than Shogun...and I haven't
tried Darkhorse yet. I want one of these boards for high speed
freeriding/carving. Thanks alot.

Have you already decided you want a Nitro or are you open to other
brands? I assume you want something to ride in soft boots, not hard -
is that correct? I'm not familiar with Nitro, but if you're willing to
entertain a few other manufacturers, I have some suggestions.

Mike T

"Mike T" wrote in message
...
I heard Shogun's are stiffer than Naturals but when I tried shoguns
last year, I thought Naturals was stiffer than Shogun...and I haven't
tried Darkhorse yet. I want one of these boards for high speed
freeriding/carving. Thanks alot.

Have you already decided you want a Nitro or are you open to other
brands? I assume you want something to ride in soft boots, not hard -
is that correct? I'm not familiar with Nitro, but if you're willing to
entertain a few other manufacturers, I have some suggestions.

Mike T

Mike T
Feeling of dejavu here - however better news group etiquette - but you're
still trying to hijack the thread and turn it around to your advantage - you
should wait to see what the responses are before jumping in and doing your
award winning self promotion of a certain brand

And as to the actual question, two years ago I rode the Natural - this year
the shogun - as to my observations, I was riding a different binding setup -
natural was with K2's the Shogun this year with quite stiff flows and a hard
soft boot - so the setup was quite agressive and very sweet -

Mike T
Feeling of dejavu here - however better news group etiquette - but
you're
still trying to hijack the thread and turn it around to your
advantage - you
should wait to see what the responses are before jumping in and doing
your
award winning self promotion of a certain brand

WeatherCam, I'm not sure I understand what you mean by "my advantage". I
am simply trying to see if the original poster would be interested in
anything other than Nitro and if so, suggest a number of choices,
including boards from Prior, Red-Air, Voelkl, F2, Salomon, and yes,
Donek. I've admittedly never been on a Nitro board but I've owned and
demoed their bindings and boots and I was less than impressed... thus
the compulsion to suggest alternatives.

I've taken to heart that I've been overzealous on this forum regarding
Donek boards, and I think I've toned it down quite a bit, and I've even
tried to mention other boards that share some of the same
characteristics. I'm really trying to be genuinely helpful, by sharing
with others what has and has not worked for me in the past. I found
this newsgroup and www.bomberonline.com instrumental in getting myself
out of a "terminal intermediate" funk, and I'm trying to give back. I
really am trying to find the right balance between helpful and annoying.
Everyone is different, so what's helpful to some will be annoying to
others. When I'm told I'm being annoying, I try to fix it.
WeatherCam, this time, I think you're being too hard on me.

Mike T

Have you already decided you want a Nitro or are you open to other
brands? I assume you want something to ride in soft boots, not hard -
is that correct? I'm not familiar with Nitro, but if you're willing to
entertain a few other manufacturers, I have some suggestions.

Mike T

Like what other brands are you referring to?

Like what other brands are you referring to?

From personal experience:

Donek - Incline, Wide or Sasquatch, depending on foot size / stance /
etc. My personal favorite. Search archives of this NG on Google, or
email me if you want to read more. It's actually not as stiff as a
Salomon Definition, 550, or FRS, but quite damp, and very well behaved
at high speeds.

Salomon - Definition, Fastback, or if you can find one, an older 550 or
FRS. The FRS is the stiffest board I've encountered that is wide for a
non-alpine stance. I actually liked that board better in hard boots
than soft, unless conditions were perfect, for me an my 190 pounds, it
was *too stiff* for anything but hero-groomers when wearing soft boots.
I've ridden all of these but the Definition, but I understand the
Definition is a name-change from the 550, so close enough.

No personal experience with the following - but recommended by people
who I consider very credible and who share my tastes for carvable
freeride/BX boards that behave well at speed. These are all boards I'd
like to demo if I ever get the chance.

Voelkl Cross. I think they stopped making it for '04. More obtainable
in Europe than North America.
F2 Eliminator, or Eliminator LTD. More obtainable in Europe than North
America.
Prior MFR. For a little extra you can order it with a custom
stiffness.
Rad-Air LSD or Tanker. The Tanker comes in sizes up to 200 cm.
Never Summer - can't remember model name - T5? Heavy, but reportedly
very stable. I've held one but never had the chance to demo.

-Mike T

Salomon - Definition, Fastback, or if you can find one, an older 550 or
FRS. The FRS is the stiffest board I've encountered that is wide for a
non-alpine stance. I actually liked that board better in hard boots
than soft, unless conditions were perfect, for me an my 190 pounds, it
was *too stiff* for anything but hero-groomers when wearing soft boots.
I've ridden all of these but the Definition, but I understand the
Definition is a name-change from the 550, so close enough.

-Mike T

That's pretty interesting point of view. When I flexed Salomon
Definition and Fastback last year, it wasn't as stiff as Nitro
boards... am I wrong?

As for Donek boards, I might even consider trying alpine setup. Any
advices or opinions?

That's pretty interesting point of view. When I flexed Salomon
Definition and Fastback last year, it wasn't as stiff as Nitro
boards... am I wrong?

If you flexed them and found the Nitro stiffer, then it must be stiffer!
The FRS's (at least the 165) were *way* stiffer than anything Salomon
makes today.

As for Donek boards, I might even consider trying alpine setup. Any
advices or opinions?

Well, anyone who is looking for the stiffest freeride/bx board they can
find is a good candidate for liking an alpine board. As far as brands
go, I'd suggest a similar list of brands:

Donek and Coiler from personal experience
Prior, Voelkl, and F2 based on trusted hearsay.

You could always look at the "hybrids" like the Donek Axis, Coiler
All-Mtn, and Prior 4x4. The sort of split the difference between a
freeride board and an alpine board stiffness and width wise... but
almost everyone who rides them does so in hard boots.

I have the Axis 172, and I ride it pretty much everywhere I ride a
freeride board - groomers of course, but also steeps, moguls, powder,
and even the terrain park now and again. As far as true alpines... I
currently have a Coiler PR 184. I feel the same way about my Coiler as
I
do about my Donek Wide - wouldn't change a thing.

Visit www.bomberonline.com for everything you wanted to know about
alpine snowboarding.

Mike T

"Mike T" wrote in message
...

You could always look at the "hybrids" like the Donek Axis, Coiler
All-Mtn, and Prior 4x4. The sort of split the difference between a
freeride board and an alpine board stiffness and width wise... but
almost everyone who rides them does so in hard boots.

I have the Axis 172, and I ride it pretty much everywhere I ride a
freeride board - groomers of course, but also steeps, moguls, powder,
and even the terrain park now and again. As far as true alpines... I
currently have a Coiler PR 184. I feel the same way about my Coiler as
I
do about my Donek Wide - wouldn't change a thing.

Mike,

Did say you used to have a Custom but are much happier with your Donek Wide?
I love my Custom. When I switched over to that model 7 years ago, my riding
(all-mountain) improved immeasurably. Still, I'm starting to wonder if I'd
be better off with a stiffer board. Do you feel the Donek Wide is so good
that the extra width doesn't actually hamper performance? (I use Palmer
Powerlinks to deal with overhang for my size 11 boots, and they're pretty
terrific. I'd probably use them on a wider board, too.) Demoing's not much
of an option, and there aren't a whole bunch of specialty shops in my town
(Long Beach, CA). Even the ones in nearby L.A. stick to the bigger brands,
so if I were to take a chance and get a Donek, I'd be buying sight-unseen.
(Also thinking about a Salomon Fastback; the Ride Timeless had intrigued me,
but several people have complained about durability. The Burton Johan only
takes medium bindings, which leaves me out.) What about Donek's durability,
warranty, and binding compatability? I've got some new Burton Missions. I
guess I'm saying I'm looking for a sure thing rather than the sort of board
that seems to polarize.

Matt
Mike T

(wjpoker) wrote in message . com...
Salomon - Definition, Fastback, or if you can find one, an older 550 or
FRS. The FRS is the stiffest board I've encountered that is wide for a
non-alpine stance. I actually liked that board better in hard boots
than soft, unless conditions were perfect, for me an my 190 pounds, it
was *too stiff* for anything but hero-groomers when wearing soft boots.
I've ridden all of these but the Definition, but I understand the
Definition is a name-change from the 550, so close enough.

-Mike T

That's pretty interesting point of view. When I flexed Salomon
Definition and Fastback last year, it wasn't as stiff as Nitro
boards... am I wrong?

As for Donek boards, I might even consider trying alpine setup. Any
advices or opinions?

I think it is the flex pattern for the Definition that also makes a
difference. It is soft on the nose, but very stiff in between the
feet. The soft nose allows you to blast through crud, while the
stiffness between the feet gives you a lot of stability and edge hold
at high speed, at the drawback of feeling a little
unwieldy/unresponsive at slower speeds. It is also harder to ollie for
jumps. I think Mike mentioned this and I agree with my old Salomon
Definition, the Salomon stiffness is kind of a "dampened" stiffness,
where if you can flex it to a certain degree, but eventually it just
stops flexing completely, and any edge energy is "wisked" away. This
is great for shock absorption, but at the cost of snap and springiness
in the nose and midsection (tail is still snappy).

I now ride a Donek Incline and I find it to be a better compromise in
stability/edge hold (almost as good as the Definition) and
responsiveness (much better). The extra torsional stiffness and narrow
waisted make it handle better in more conditions/speeds. For instance,
I found the Definition a chore to manuever through trees and the park.

I haven't tried any recent Nitro board models, but I think they are a
very good brand and definitely worth considering. Unfortunately, the
last Nitro board I rode was over 5 years ago so I don't think anything
applies anymore. However, just looking at their website
(www.nitrousa.com/www.nitro.de). Darkhorse is the customized Shogun
model at 800 Euro, Shogun is next at 660, and the Natural is after
that at 550. The Darkhorse and the Shogun are freeride models while
the Natural is the "all-mountain" model which implies that it is
geared for jumps as the well (softer flex between the feet).

I do ride a Neversummer Evo and have ridden their Premier and it is a
very good board, extremely stable and smooth carver... a bit heftier,
but with tons of shock absorption built in without killing the
resposiveness (but it is definitely a cruiser board and not a frenetic
carving board).

Good luck!
--Arvin