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#11
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Booker C. Bense wrote:
How do you manage to turn on double camber skis? _ Sidecut, but none of the S-bound skis is anywhere near as stiff as a double camber waxable ski. They use a negative pattern base that does not require as much camber to still be relatively fast. I would suggest the other answer is "practice". Amazing what you can do with more experience. As long as it's benign snow I can tele and parallel my sidecut-free track skis, which I certainly haven't /always/ been able to do! Pete. -- Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK net http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/ |
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#12
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How do you manage to turn on double camber skis?
Sidecut. I would suggest the other answer is "practice". Yeah, practice! My son, who has competed in a ski orienteering world championship on cross country skis, can turn pretty goods telemark turns on his javelin-shaped skating skis. Tommy T. |
#13
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My wife and I bought Ursas and E99s, respectively. She noticed that it
was much easier for her to stay in control on tight trails than it was skiing the more traditional length and width skis, like E99s. I've taken the E99's to the resort and linked tele turns down blue runs, but this is not what the skis are designed for. In the backcountry, unless you're in real soft snow, it's pretty tough to get these things to turn. I'm using NNN/BC bindings. If you're serious about getting this kind of gear to turn, I'd recommend practicing under ideal conditions. By the way, my wife doesn't feel that the Ursa's are any slower than the more traditional shaped skis. I had a bad experience with rented Lookouts (the predecessor of the Pavo) once where they felt super slow, which steered me towards the lengthier E99s. In hindsight, I think that the snow was just really sticky that day - or something. |
#14
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wrote in message oups.com... My wife and I bought Ursas and E99s, respectively. She noticed that it was much easier for her to stay in control on tight trails than it was skiing the more traditional length and width skis, like E99s. I've taken the E99's to the resort and linked tele turns down blue runs, but this is not what the skis are designed for. In the backcountry, unless you're in real soft snow, it's pretty tough to get these things to turn. I'm using NNN/BC bindings. If you're serious about getting this kind of gear to turn, I'd recommend practicing under ideal conditions. By the way, my wife doesn't feel that the Ursa's are any slower than the more traditional shaped skis. I had a bad experience with rented Lookouts (the predecessor of the Pavo) once where they felt super slow, which steered me towards the lengthier E99s. In hindsight, I think that the snow was just really sticky that day - or something. Interesting... I skied a pair of skinny waxless 185's two weeks ago. Normally I ski 205/210. They were noticeably slower (really they are too short for me), but it was - I'm ashamed to admit it - a joy to feel so unencumbered! Now I just have to decide between the 175 and 190's. With a well stocked daypack I'm somewhere in between,.. |
#15
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In article ,
Booker C. Bense bbense+rec.skiing.backcountry.Mar.23.05@telemark. slac.stanford.edu wrote: -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- In article , Hal Murray wrote: How do you manage to turn on double camber skis? _ Sidecut, but none of the S-bound skis is anywhere near as stiff as a double camber waxable ski. They use a negative pattern base that does not require as much camber to still be relatively fast. I do downhill/AT skiing as fa as I remember. 5-6 years ago I started XC skiing. Well, ski-hiking... This year I started telemarking. I can telemark on my old touring set (Madshus_something 60-50-55 waxless +Salomon Country9 +SNSProfile). But it is much easier on my new set (Karhu Vela 70-60-65 -175cm + SalomonAdventure8 (or Adventure Raid - I've bought both of them because of lack of the response here)+ SNS BC). However going up and even running on the flat is awkward (comparing with that Madshus set). These Karhu are waxable but do have negative fishscale. I have no idea how can I wax (I mean gripwaxes and klisters) waxable skis with a fishscale. I suspect the pattern was made in the ski shop. Should I return these skis? :-( TA |
#16
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-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
In article , wrote: In article , Booker C. Bense bbense+rec.skiing.backcountry.Mar.23.05@telemark. slac.stanford.edu wrote: -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- In article , Hal Murray wrote: How do you manage to turn on double camber skis? _ Sidecut, but none of the S-bound skis is anywhere near as stiff as a double camber waxable ski. They use a negative pattern base that does not require as much camber to still be relatively fast. I do downhill/AT skiing as fa as I remember. 5-6 years ago I started XC skiing. Well, ski-hiking... This year I started telemarking. I can telemark on my old touring set (Madshus_something 60-50-55 waxless +Salomon Country9 +SNSProfile). But it is much easier on my new set (Karhu Vela 70-60-65 -175cm + SalomonAdventure8 (or Adventure Raid - I've bought both of them because of lack of the response here)+ SNS BC). However going up and even running on the flat is awkward (comparing with that Madshus set). _ There is no free lunch, you have to pick where you want to compromise performance btw kick'n'glide and making turns. These Karhu are waxable but do have negative fishscale. I have no idea how can I wax (I mean gripwaxes and klisters) waxable skis with a fishscale. I suspect the pattern was made in the ski shop. _ Highly unlikely. Those are waxless skis. If they have a pattern cut into the base, you could just fill it in with Ptex. However, since Ptex repairs aren't sintered they don't hold the wax as well. Are you having problems getting enough kick out of the skis? If you really want you can just put kick wax on a negative pattern base, but in general it doesn't work well and is a bear to clean afterwards. Probably the only time this really makes any sense is in hard icy conditions where there is nothing for the pattern to grip. (i.e. blue klister ). _ If you need more climbing power, try kicker skins. Should I return these skis? _ If you want to wax, buy waxable skis. It doesn't sound to me like there's anything wrong with the skis you have. _ Booker C. Bense -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: 2.6.2 iQCVAwUBQkmkg2TWTAjn5N/lAQHUOwQAnixi2mLc/McLCn5XIdBJaxff+d++k9B0 HhLK0PxaIK5ePdLP4vUkhIck3+hxJM0Cz1ZnDYBmlxpST7TyeJ Gp6Ptye+86HGer S98p0eECqodGT3683PuTK23YHmpbEKK+NuszShD3NmwC8UuigX KTUhEOsaq1a/Hi NkL4Q9fw39k= =J5nZ -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- |
#17
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In article ,
Booker C. Bense bbense+rec.skiing.backcountry.Mar.29.05@telemark. slac.stanford.edu wrote: -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- In article , wrote: In article , Booker C. Bense bbense+rec.skiing.backcountry.Mar.23.05@telemark. slac.stanford.edu wrote: These Karhu are waxable but do have negative fishscale. I have no idea how can I wax (I mean gripwaxes and klisters) waxable skis with a fishscale. I suspect the pattern was made in the ski shop. _ Highly unlikely. Those are waxless skis. So what does 'sintered waxable base' (written on the base) mean?? Are you having problems getting enough kick out of the skis? Right If you really want you can just put kick wax on a negative pattern base, but in general it doesn't work well and is a bear to clean afterwards. Yes, I've realised that already. :-( _ If you need more climbing power, try kicker skins. Should I return these skis? _ If you wantto wax, buy waxable skis. They are supposed to be waxable (according to the info on the base) It doesn't sound to me like there's anything wrong with the skis you have. Nobody understand me :-( TA |
#18
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-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
In article , wrote: In article , Booker C. Bense bbense+rec.skiing.backcountry.Mar.29.05@telemark. slac.stanford.edu wrote: -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- In article , wrote: In article , Booker C. Bense bbense+rec.skiing.backcountry.Mar.23.05@telemark. slac.stanford.edu wrote: These Karhu are waxable but do have negative fishscale. I have no idea how can I wax (I mean gripwaxes and klisters) waxable skis with a fishscale. I suspect the pattern was made in the ski shop. _ Highly unlikely. Those are waxless skis. So what does 'sintered waxable base' (written on the base) mean?? _ It means you can hot wax the skis and it will penetrate the base. Ptex can either be extruded ( bad ) or sintered. The best no-wax skis are made with sintered bases and either a positive or negative pattern. The less good ones are extruded and can't really be hot waxed. _ Waxless skis are poorly named, they all need some kind of glide wax to work effectively ( both for glide and kick ). The kick section won't grip unless the snow slides off easily. _ I would suggest either taking the skis back or trying kicker skins. They also may be too long for you as well, most of the newer skis are meant to be skied shorter. If the ski shop really did carve a pattern into the base, then I would return them ASAP. A ski meant for kick waxing is generally going to be too stiff to work well with a homemade negative pattern base. _ Booker C. Bense -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: 2.6.2 iQCVAwUBQlHAbGTWTAjn5N/lAQHh7AQAmqpDfQpqviwNEoeKa452/ayb+9xtODxT 9rhvpQrin5ZAy/CXofXGGQTMsyH42wbfG/dXLXO8V+hsoc+msRq1sLPH9oP1dtNw 8cCSHqRzV/Twlmql8TxpQaeaRzGoFtFFRxsJwiPeI/QTgmoXoanckC9JCw/6wQVz OaWlRXwg8Ow= =mrgB -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- |
#19
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In article ,
Booker C. Bense bbense+rec.skiing.backcountry.Apr.04.05@telemark. slac.stanford.edu wrote: -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- In article , wrote: In article , Booker C. Bense bbense+rec.skiing.backcountry.Mar.29.05@telemark. slac.stanford.edu wrote: -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- In article , wrote: In article , Booker C. Bense bbense+rec.skiing.backcountry.Mar.23.05@telemark. slac.stanford.edu wrote: These Karhu are waxable but do have negative fishscale. I have no idea how can I wax (I mean gripwaxes and klisters) waxable skis with a fishscale. I suspect the pattern was made in the ski shop. _ Highly unlikely. Those are waxless skis. So what does 'sintered waxable base' (written on the base) mean?? _ It means you can hot wax the skis and it will penetrate the base. Oh, there was just a kind of sarcasm... Once again: I've bought Karhu Vela with a negative fishscale. Which seems to not to work. And on the base one can read: 'sintered waxable base'. Hence my suspicions... [...] _ I would suggest either taking the skis back or trying kicker skins. They also may be too long for you as well, most of the newer skis are meant to be skied shorter. They ARE short. I am 182cm/75kg. My classic skis are about 200cm. These Karhu are 175cm. If the ski shop really did carve a pattern into the base, then I would return them ASAP. A ski meant for kick waxing is generally going to be too stiff to work well with a homemade negative pattern base. I will try to do that... :-( I will see if they take them back... TA |
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