Flow Forward Lean...

Can anyone with Flows tell me a little bit about the forward lean
adjustment and how the binding feels if you have a good bit of forward
lean?

I see how it is adjusted...you shorten the cable when you mount the
binding (using binding adjustments) and you can also tweak small adjustments
on the highback. However, it seems that if you tighten the cable you will
also be tightening the binding, is this true?

If I want a good bit of forward lean on a pair of Flows (Pro-S) will
I be uncomfortably tightening the whole system?


And, any recent comments on flows is appreciated. I have Ride Mig bindings
now which I like, but I was hoping to get rid of some strap preassure
points if I tried Flows.

Thanks,
-todd

Todd,

Just to let you know where I come from in terms of riding, mainly freeride
and big mountain. Have used a set of strap-ins twice and clickers once
before I bought myself a set of Flows. I really like them for how easy they
are but they do have issues.

In regards to your forward lean question. I feel that you can get plenty of
forward lean out of flows. Though I don't ride with a huge amount of
forward lean like I have seen some people, I ride with a moderate amount.
Just tightening the screw on the highback will increase the forward lean,
but it makes the highback much more difficult to lock into place (and
unlock, I would suggest tightening at the bottom instead of the highback);
however when doing this I have not really noticed that the binding feels
overly tighter than before. I understand why you ask this since it seems
like the foot "strap" on Flows seems to be rather stationary, however it is
very easy to adjust having 4 corners to adjust with. If they seem tighter
up top then you can just loosen the top two straps and things should be ok.

Hope that partially answers your question, but overall I would buy another
set of flow bindings. The step in and go system is just too cool to go back
to strapping in. Another point that I will make which I have noticed lately
since I have been playing with binding angles is that it is easy (or there
is a lack of support in Flows) to twist your foot, say, in and then trying
to push forward you have no support. Example, recently I had my front foot
turned out too much and I was trying to turn the board with a motion that
was perpendicular to the board which was not the same line as parallel to
the binding since it was set at +30 degrees. At this angle I had no
leverage with the flows, this may be true with other bindings as well, I
haven't used other types enough. But as long as you are exerting force in
line with the bindings there is no problem with these bindings.

One more comment that people may not think about. Flows do not fold down
very well for travel. The whole foot "Strap" has to come off for the high
back to fold down, this is a pain to remove when cold out and then you also
have to get it set back where you want it. This is not super difficult
since they just click down, but I always find myself taking 1-2 more clicks
out of each corner about half way through the day when I readjust them.
They just take up a lot of space when traveling that's all. Hope this
helps, if ya have more specific questions email me.

Ed

I will never ride another binding other than Flow. I have been
through more misery than you can imagine with straps and have almost
given up riding altogether because of foot pain. I like my system
tight and therefore like my boots snug (too tight = pain) and bindings
TIGHT. I just bought a new pair of Burton P1's (which are up for
sale) since they also caused me tremendous pain. I did the research
and decided on Flow Pro Series. This has completely shed new light on
snowboarding for me and my ability has skyrocketed. I have NO foot
pain whatsoever and they are sooooo responsive and tight. No heal lift
whatsoever. The forward lean is awesome and i haven't experienced
anything negative. The convenience is something to smile about. It's
true that you'll be waiting for your friends to strap in when your
roaring to go...or traversing flats and skating and just clipping in
on the fly. It's awesome. I can't recommend this binding enough.
For both comfort and convenience i would pay double what i did if i
had to. Now i love snowboarding once again.

PS. If anyone is interested in an almost new pair of Burton P1 MD
Medium size let me know. I just rode them 2 days and have no use for
them.






(toddjb) wrote in message . com...
Can anyone with Flows tell me a little bit about the forward lean
adjustment and how the binding feels if you have a good bit of forward
lean?

I see how it is adjusted...you shorten the cable when you mount the
binding (using binding adjustments) and you can also tweak small adjustments
on the highback. However, it seems that if you tighten the cable you will
also be tightening the binding, is this true?

If I want a good bit of forward lean on a pair of Flows (Pro-S) will
I be uncomfortably tightening the whole system?


And, any recent comments on flows is appreciated. I have Ride Mig bindings
now which I like, but I was hoping to get rid of some strap preassure
points if I tried Flows.

Thanks,
-todd

On 18 Dec 2003 06:23:39 -0800, toddjb said (and I quote):
Can anyone with Flows tell me a little bit about the forward lean
adjustment and how the binding feels if you have a good bit of forward
lean?

I see how it is adjusted...you shorten the cable when you mount the
binding (using binding adjustments) and you can also tweak small adjustments
on the highback. However, it seems that if you tighten the cable you will
also be tightening the binding, is this true?

Yes, you've got it exactly. Adjusting the forward lean also affects
the whole fit of the binding. This is not necessarily a problem,
unless you like to adjust the forward lean often. Basically, the
Flows can be a bit of a hassle to get set up exactly how you like,
but once set up they are super quick, easy and convenient.

If I want a good bit of forward lean on a pair of Flows (Pro-S) will
I be uncomfortably tightening the whole system?

I've found that the design of the Flows seems to assume only a fairly
limited amount of forward lean. If you like *lots* of forward lean
(like me), then you might find that there is no real way to make the
toe strap fit properly - it will be deformed just like in the "Don't
do this!" picture in the Flow manual.

(Note that my experience with Flows is with the FL-11 from quite a
few years ago. They might have changed in this regard since then,
but from my casual observation, they don't seem to have.)

I'd recommend trying on the Flows with your boots, and playing around
with the forward lean to see how they feel. This might be hard to do
unless you have access to some Flows that actually mounted to a
board.
--
A: Top-posters.
Q: What's the most annoying thing on usenet?

"Baka Dasai" wrote
Yes, you've got it exactly. Adjusting the forward lean also affects
the whole fit of the binding.

Agreed. I have ridden various Flows for several years (FL11, FL29, FL39) and
despite some of the problems mentioned here I do still like them. I think if
you were to use a lot of forward lean though (which can be achieved by
adjusting the cables) the footstrap will have a limited ability to move
forward and, unless you have very skinny ankles, you may not be able to get
into them.

There is a technique which I wrote about recently he
http://www.snowgo.com/archives/2003/...itting_tip.php which
can help get a better fit. This has certainly made Flows more comfortable
for me and it might help you too but I would suggest taking your boots to a
store and checking them in the bindings with the desired amount of forward
lean.

Luke

-------------------------
http://www.snowgo.com

actually now that i think of it, since i like a moderate amount of
lean, the front straps "twist" slightly instead of being straight
since the strap is pushed forward. I'm sure it's not a big deal and i
still think this binding is the cats ass.


(toddjb) wrote in message . com...
Can anyone with Flows tell me a little bit about the forward lean
adjustment and how the binding feels if you have a good bit of forward
lean?

I see how it is adjusted...you shorten the cable when you mount the
binding (using binding adjustments) and you can also tweak small adjustments
on the highback. However, it seems that if you tighten the cable you will
also be tightening the binding, is this true?

If I want a good bit of forward lean on a pair of Flows (Pro-S) will
I be uncomfortably tightening the whole system?


And, any recent comments on flows is appreciated. I have Ride Mig bindings
now which I like, but I was hoping to get rid of some strap preassure
points if I tried Flows.

Thanks,
-todd

The whole foot "Strap" has to come off for the high
back to fold down, this is a pain to remove when cold out and then you
also
have to get it set back where you want it. This is not super difficult
since they just click down, but I always find myself taking 1-2 more
clicks
out of each corner about half way through the day when I readjust them.


I put a mark on each strap where the ratchet was when it was a good fit so I
can set the bindings up really quickly when I unpack without having to have
my feet in.

Liz

Thanks Ed, Baka and all for the good tips.

I had forgotten that if I add more lean, I can raise the back clips
on the foot strap to give me more room. Luckily my local shop let me
take the binding home to play with (as long as I don't ride them) so
I'll see how it works out.

Thanks also for the Snowgo link...if I end up keeping them, I'll try
the home molding technique.

As I may have said, I have a pair of Ride Migs that I like from a
performance standpoint, but, I find myself having to adjust all 4
straps before each run since I also loosen the front straps for the
lift ride. I'd rather not do all this adjusting before every run
if I can help it. Hopefully the Flows work out for me.

I ended up buying the Pro-S FS binding (originally had the Pro-S FR, but
it was the wrong size). The difference is a 50% stiffer back and
slightly higher strap material on the outward facing side. I do mainly
freeride, powder, moguls, trees some jumps, but little other in the park.
All the same, I'm hoping the FS will still work for me and I may like
that they are a bit more flexible. We'll see....

-todd

"lizbubb" wrote in message ...


I put a mark on each strap where the ratchet was when it was a good fit so I
can set the bindings up really quickly when I unpack without having to have
my feet in.

Liz


Wow, I didn't realize how inconvenient they were until I attached them
to my board and rode with them (which went fine). Those things are
huge and are a tough fit in my board bag which i use for local travel
as well.

Any tips?

Taking the strap off to fold down the highback seems fine for airline
travel but would be a pain before each local trip. I have a wheeled
Dakine board bag which I love...take it with me everywhere and its nice
to have it all in one bag. Does Flow make padded wheeled bags that
better accomodate the two lumps of Flow on my board (or anyone
else)

I did like the first short day I got to try with the Flows, though.

Thanks,
-todd