Profil or Pilot bindings; Race Skate 9 and Carbon Pro boot fit; Best sources for V2 105 SR; Type of socks; Leg brake; Poles

Thanks

We are serious, and I know Adams well, my wife and I spent a week
hiking the area in September 04 and we've hiked Mt Greylock several
times before. I'd gladly head there or to the High Peaks Cyclery in
the Adirondaks or to Nordic Skater in Vermont or anywhere else within
3-6 hours drive for a shop that will simply have a selection of boots
to try on in several sizes around our sizes. It's very hard to find a
shop that will have 2-3 different boots to try on in two sizes each.
Many shops (understandably) try to sell you what they have, not
necessarily what will work best for you.

Can you imagine us putting all those questions together if we weren't
serious? : )

Have a good weekend,

Mountainwalker

Mountainwalker,

I've rollerskied on two pairs of Jenex Aero 150s with the
calf-activated brakes, one pair mounted with Salomon profil bindings,
the other with Pilot bindings. I also rollerski with both Salomon
Racing Skate 9 boots and Carbon Pro boots. First, the brakes are very
reliable and have allowed me to rollerski on hilly roads that I
wouldn't attempt on rollerskis without some brake mechanism. I don't
think the Jenex speed reducers are intended to serve in a braking
capacity; they're intended to slow the ski for more resistance in the
workout. So, if you're looking for a safety feature that allows you to
come to relatively quick stops, the brakes, rather than the speed
reducers are the way to go.

My first pair of Aero 150s were mounted with profil bindings to match
the profil boots I was using at the time of purchase. When I later
bought pilot-soled Racing Skate 9 boots, I found the profil bindings on
the rollerskis worked perfectly well with the pilot boots. In fact, I
liked the ride even more because the Racing Skate 9 boots press up
against the stiff flexor (toe bumper) more aggressively. If you examine
the front toe-bar area of profil and pilot skate boots, I think you'll
notice that the front toe bar on the pilot boots sits back a hair more
under the toe of the boot than it does on the profil boot. This small
change in placement of the toe bar means that when mated with the
profil binding, the pilot boot exerts more pressure on the flexor than
the profil-soled boot.

In my experience with the Aero 150, the additional pressure that the
pilot boot exerts on the profil flexor makes for a much more ski-like
ride. My second pair of Aero 150s were mounted with pilot bindings.
After two unhappy outings on the Aero 150s with pilot bindings, I had
the pilot bindings removed, and the skis were remounted with profil
bindings. The advice you referenced from NordicSkater matches my
experience. The Aero 150s are heavier than snow skis and, therefore,
the angle of separation between boot and rollerski with pilot bindings
is too great on the return phase from push off. (The weight of the
rollerski means the rollerski pulls away from the boot too much on the
return phase of skating.) The pilot-mounted Aero 150s felt like they
were dragging/dangling out there. I found this really annoying. The
back pressure of the profil flexor on the pilot boot keeps the boot and
Aero 150 more "together" on return phase -- much more like snow skiing.


The SR 100/105 is supposed to be lighter than the Aero 150, so perhaps
the SR 100/105 wouldn't "hang" as much on the return phase with pilot
bindings. Perhaps this is a statement of heresy (as many successful
high-level racers use the pilot binding on snow skis), but I strongly
prefer the profil binding -- even on snow skis. I bought new Atomic
RS-11s and Rossi X-iums this past season and had them mounted with
profil skating bindings (115 flexors). If I didn't have so much
invested in Salomon pilot boots, I would switch to the NNN system,
which still employs the tried-and-true flexor approach on its new R4
binding. (Hmmm ... Fischer's reportedly going to shift its boot-sole
format to NNN. I'd be grateful if Salomon would continue to offer
flexor-based profil bindings with skate flexors.)

And, this brings me to your query about boots. The Carbon Pros are more
narrow, which means I need a half size larger than the Racing Skate 9s.
I like them both quite a bit. The Racing Skate 9s are warmer boots
(nice in winter, a bit too toasty in the summer) and feel a bit more
supportive for rollerskiing, but the lighter weight of the Carbon Pros
makes for a more speedy feel. Some have said Carbon Pros fit like cruel
shoes; they fit fine for me -- definitely more snug, but better ski
feel.

Good luck with the rollerskiing.


wrote:
First, thank you to all of you for sharing your experience on this
usenet. I've picked up some great tips.

I'm new to roller skiing, about to pick up my first pair of roller
skis. I've done a lot of research and plan on picking up V2 105 SR
roller skis, which Jenex is supposed to re-release in early June (the
first release was called 100 SR but was recalled because of problems
with early tire wear). For the type of roller skiing I intend to do,
skate skiing on relatively smooth pavement for fitness all year around
in the Northeast, I think these skis and tires will provide the best
experience - they are fairly low to the ground, the tires have a
forgiving feel, and the skis are more stable than the V2 125 or 150.

I'm thinking of getting the following package:

V2 105 SR roller skis with
Skate bindings - Profil or Pilot???
Salomon Race Skate 9 boots or Carbon Pro boots???
Speed reducer
Poles with sharp road tips

Questions:

1) Can anyone suggest any good sources, mail order and stores, for a
complete package for the above? I've already found a few, interested
in your suggestions.

2) I've heard that the Carbon Pro boots have a narrower toe box than
the Race Skate 9s. Is this true? Can anyone comment on the fit?

3) With a true US shoe size of 11, and given that I typically take an
11.5 hiking shoe or running shoe, and generally take either a normal or
EE shoe depending on the cut, which size Carbon Pros and Skate 9s would
you suggest?

4) How tight a fit should I go for? Too tight and I'm afraid the boot
will not allow enough circulation to keep my feet warm in winter.

5) Which boot, Skate 9 or Carbon Pro, is going to be hotter in summer?

6) Given that I plan on roller skiing 4 seasons, and here summers get
hot and winters get cold, can anyone suggest which kind of sock to use
with the boot? Light hiking merino sock, medium sock or heavier
ski/winter sock?

7) Which binding should I use, Profil or Pilot? I read a post on this
usenet that Jamie of NordicSkater in Vermont recommends people use
Profil bindings instead of Pilot because the boot bumper is stiffer,
preventing some of the RS hang when one picks up one's foot. What is
meant by RS hang? Return ski? The poster wrote that the Pilot bumper
is softer so that the ski tail will drop farther. What is the
advantage of a Pilot binding at all then, if there is one?

8) If one has a speed reducer, is the leg brake worthwhile?

9) Can anyone make any roller skiing pole recommendations? Especially
poles that will plant firmly but absorb some shock (though good form
will probably get rid of the impact felt). I'm 6 ft 180 lbs if that
helps. And can you recommend good sources for cheap poles? From
winter skiing it just seems there are always many used poles to pick up
in fairly good shape.

I'd sincerely appreciate any comments/suggestions.

I have a somewhat simian foot, and suffer the tortures of the damned
with width issues. Only thing I've found decent are ROssignols
thermo-form. Interestingly, I picked up a pair of Atomic skate ski boots
this year that are fantastic, although they have a tenancy to separate
at the zipper, so I've been told.
I have both the Rossi X-6 combis and the skate for interested parties.

Randy

thanks for the suggestion. Spoke with Steve,
he really does know his stuff and seems to have a very good selection
of boots to choose from.

Marcuski,

That was a super informative post. What luck to find someone that has
used the Skate 9 and the Carbon Pro and has used V2s! Thanks very much
for sharing.

Found out the new Carbon Pros, which are available already, have a
roomier toe box like the Skate 9s. However, heard they're all black,
while the 2005 Carbon Pros and Skate 9s are silver. I imagine the 2006
Carbon Pro will be very hot in summer with the black absorbing heat
from the sun (though as you pointed out the Race Skate 9 is a thicker,
warmer boot than the Carbon Pro). Which boot would you recommend, for
all year use, assuming fit works for us? The 2005 Carbon Pro, the 2006
Carbon Pro or the 2005 Race Skate 9? My wife will probably be OK with
the 2005 Carbon Pro, but I may need the slightly roomier toe box of the
Race Skate 9 2005 or Carbon Pro 2006.

Re socks, we'd like to use our roller skis all year, but we're buying
one set of boots each - which means we have to buy them with a fit for
a particular thickness of sock. We were thinking we'd use light merino
hiking socks, with a super thin liner sock underneath.

What would you recommend for poles? Would you recommend a single piece
shaft or a multi-section adjustable? I ask because adjustables are
obviously easier to travel with.

The V2 100/105 body is available, but Jenex has yet to release with the
new microcellular tubes - if we pick up the skis before Jenex gets
their tire act together (they've had trouble finding a tire that will
not wear out too quickly), which air tube tire should we use in the
meantime? We liked the fact that the 100/105 also use slightly smaller
tires than the V2 150 or 125, better for pavement - we just don't want
to wait all summer for Jenex to find a tire.

Thanks again for all the great advice.

On 14 May 2006 21:06:58 -0700, "mountainwalker"
wrote:

Re socks, we'd like to use our roller skis all year, but we're buying
one set of boots each - which means we have to buy them with a fit for
a particular thickness of sock. We were thinking we'd use light merino
hiking socks, with a super thin liner sock underneath.

I don't think it's normal to use racing ski boots with two pairs of
socks.

JFT

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Hi JFT,
The liner sock is a super thin sock - and a light hiking sock is about
as thin as a casual shoe sock. The liner sock just helps prevent
blisters and makes the boot more comfortable in both hot and cold
weather - very common to use in backpacking and hiking Helps get rid
of moisture and heat, and instead of your foot rubbing against the
sock, the socks rub against each other. Do you think the liner sock
would cause a performance problem? Anyway, most important is a boot
that fits very well.
Thanks.

Mountainwalker,

Glad to hear you found the user feedback to be helpful. To be honest,
I'm not sure if I can offer any advice on which of the three boots to
go with. I haven't skied on the new "black beauty" Carbon Pro boots,
although, I, too, have read the toebox is supposed to be more roomy
than that of the silver Carbon Pro boots. If the fit of all three boots
works for you, perhaps you might like the lighter/faster ride of the
Carbon Pros. The Racing Skate 9s feel more stable, but my forward ankle
flex feels less restrained in the Carbon Pros, and that -- very
subjectively -- feels faster and quicker on the turnover. Maybe I don't
need that taller and more supportive cuff on the Racing Skate 9. I
would imagine that fit is a greater priority than the relative heat
retaining properties of the boots since your feet are going to be hot
and sweaty no matter what. So, if you can, try them all on. At this
time of year, you might find a good deal on the silver Racing Skate 9
and Carbon Pros, since they're being discontinued.

Regarding socks, I wear a coolmax-light wool blend with no liner.
Cotton is the fast path to blisters.

I don't know of folks who rollerski with adjustable poles, such as
those made for hiking or snowshoeing. I think you would be better
served by using regular Nordic ski poles that are at least moderately
stiff -- maybe 40 percent carbon. I use Swix CT-4 poles with rollerski
ferrules mounted on the tips. I have used less stiff poles with more
fiberglass and less carbon. These lower-grade poles bowed sharply
everytime I poled hard, especially up hills. When poles bow, energy is
lost which causes inefficiency. Plus, it just feels all wrong to put a
lot of force into your poling only feel them bend. Your poling will
feel more energetic and powerful if you use at least a moderately stiff
ski pole.

Several V2 rollerski vendors describe the 150 as a ski better suited
for those who weigh more than 180lbs. and for rougher roads. The 150
uses 6-inch wheels; the 125 uses 5-inch wheels. I use the 150
exclusively on roads, which, in my neck of the woods are pebble-strewn
and rife with cracks. The pneumatic wheels are susceptible to flats,
but this has happend only once in more than a year. I wear a fanny pack
with a spare rim-mounted tire and two small (4-inch) tools required for
swapping -- it's easy to do and takes about three minutes. The culprit
was a carpet nail on the road. Obviously, getting a flat is a far
greater problem if the rear braking wheel gets "nailed," and you're
hurtling down a hill. Then, I suppose, it would be time to bail for a
patch of grass.

I have read the general sentiment that there are better, lighter
hard-wheeled rollerskis that make for a more ski-like ride (e.g. Marwe
610, Elpex F-1), but for the road conditions I'm forced to contend
with, I need the brake and the ability to roll over just about anything
without a hitch.

Hope this helps.

mountainwalker wrote:
Marcuski,

That was a super informative post. What luck to find someone that has
used the Skate 9 and the Carbon Pro and has used V2s! Thanks very much
for sharing.

Found out the new Carbon Pros, which are available already, have a
roomier toe box like the Skate 9s. However, heard they're all black,
while the 2005 Carbon Pros and Skate 9s are silver. I imagine the 2006
Carbon Pro will be very hot in summer with the black absorbing heat
from the sun (though as you pointed out the Race Skate 9 is a thicker,
warmer boot than the Carbon Pro). Which boot would you recommend, for
all year use, assuming fit works for us? The 2005 Carbon Pro, the 2006
Carbon Pro or the 2005 Race Skate 9? My wife will probably be OK with
the 2005 Carbon Pro, but I may need the slightly roomier toe box of the
Race Skate 9 2005 or Carbon Pro 2006.

Re socks, we'd like to use our roller skis all year, but we're buying
one set of boots each - which means we have to buy them with a fit for
a particular thickness of sock. We were thinking we'd use light merino
hiking socks, with a super thin liner sock underneath.

What would you recommend for poles? Would you recommend a single piece
shaft or a multi-section adjustable? I ask because adjustables are
obviously easier to travel with.

The V2 100/105 body is available, but Jenex has yet to release with the
new microcellular tubes - if we pick up the skis before Jenex gets
their tire act together (they've had trouble finding a tire that will
not wear out too quickly), which air tube tire should we use in the
meantime? We liked the fact that the 100/105 also use slightly smaller
tires than the V2 150 or 125, better for pavement - we just don't want
to wait all summer for Jenex to find a tire.

Thanks again for all the great advice.

"Marcuski" schreef in bericht
ups.com...
The pneumatic wheels are susceptible to flats,
but this has happend only once in more than a year.
I greatly advise running tire sealent in the tubes. I've had several flats
(overnight) with my crosskates, and just adding under an ounce of sealent
always did the trick, and flats never came back. In 150mm wheels, a mere
ounce would be like topping them off, making flats something that will just
not happen until it dries out. I've been riding a townie bike with a big fat
nail in the front tire for over half a year now. Sealent was in there
already, I never noticed getting the nail in, just got annoyed by a ticking
sounds and eventually looked after a few weeks of riding it like that.

On 15 May 2006 07:57:07 -0700, "mountainwalker"
wrote:

Do you think the liner sock [under other sock]
would cause a performance problem?

I don't know. I just haven't heard of it being done with racing
equipment and don't see the point.

JFT

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