Wedge vs. Stem; The Difference.

foot2foot wrote:
"yunlong" wrote in message
oups.com...
Likewise, I encountered more people confused on "inside/outside"
terminology than people used "uphill/downhill."

You've encountered people who were raised on that crap.
You have to be rutheless here.

Nonsense, so you think that only the terminology you used is correct,
and another people's terminology is crap?

Crap it is.

Just tell 'em, no more uphill downhill.

Why? Uphill/downhill are not the natural environment of skiing?

There's nothing wrong with uphill/downhill terminology; just because
you are confused with it doesn't mean it is invalid.

Chances are all those people are talking about
different things anyway. Like I said, no one ever really
meant the same thing. You had to interpret it each time.

Why? You cannot define/remember/memorize it?



In fact, that's why I
use both terms.

Nah, don't bother. It's really not done anymore for good
reason, if someone's still doing it, clue them into the
wonder of inside/outside ski.

You still explain it in terms of inside and outside while they already
confused with the terms [inside and outside]? You are pretty proud of
your arrogance, aren't you?

As well, I also use "big toe side" and "little toe
side," and I use "little toe side" so to avoid the confuse
which/what
is "pinky."

True, "little toe edge" is probably better as you describe,
unless someone knows what pinky is. Or, you could say
"pinky toe edge" which also probably gets the idea across.

That was to say it's better to use terminology that your clients can
understand, (instead of your own pet terminology,) so your teaching
serves your clients.


None of them learned parallel in two hours.

You actually explain this to a seven year old?

All the time. They eat it up like candy.

Really? Did you tell them to use "inside/outside ski" or
"left/right
ski/foot"?

I described it earlier. Walk in a circle and have them ID the
inside and outside feet. Left or right is not relevant it would
only confuse.

Still "walking," eh? The question was how do they "ski"?

With the kids who cannot distinguish what left and right are, and you
think they know what your inside and outside are on the fly?

That is to say most beginners forget what they have just learned when
the skis start to slide.



No, it is turning on the inside ski; that is, press the right ski
for
right turn and press the left ski for left turn.

The outside ski is the outside ski all the way around the turn.
Same with the inside ski. Simple. It has to be kept simple.


Nothing [in skiing] simpler than press the right ski to turn right, and
press left ski to turn left, and that is flat-boarding.


IS

foot2foot wrote:
"yunlong" wrote in message
oups.com...
Likewise, I encountered more people confused on "inside/outside"
terminology than people used "uphill/downhill."

You've encountered people who were raised on that crap.
You have to be rutheless here.

Nonsense, so you think that only the terminology you used is correct,
and another people's terminology is crap?

Crap it is.

Just tell 'em, no more uphill downhill.

Why? Uphill/downhill are not the natural environment of skiing?

There's nothing wrong with uphill/downhill terminology; just because
you are confused with it doesn't mean it is invalid.

Chances are all those people are talking about
different things anyway. Like I said, no one ever really
meant the same thing. You had to interpret it each time.

Why? You cannot define/remember/memorize it?



In fact, that's why I
use both terms.

Nah, don't bother. It's really not done anymore for good
reason, if someone's still doing it, clue them into the
wonder of inside/outside ski.

You still explain it in terms of inside and outside while they already
confused with the terms [inside and outside]? You are pretty proud of
your arrogance, aren't you?

As well, I also use "big toe side" and "little toe
side," and I use "little toe side" so to avoid the confuse
which/what
is "pinky."

True, "little toe edge" is probably better as you describe,
unless someone knows what pinky is. Or, you could say
"pinky toe edge" which also probably gets the idea across.

That was to say it's better to use terminology that your clients can
understand, (instead of your own pet terminology,) so your teaching
serves your clients.


None of them learned parallel in two hours.

You actually explain this to a seven year old?

All the time. They eat it up like candy.

Really? Did you tell them to use "inside/outside ski" or
"left/right
ski/foot"?

I described it earlier. Walk in a circle and have them ID the
inside and outside feet. Left or right is not relevant it would
only confuse.

Still "walking," eh? The question was how do they "ski"?

With the kids who cannot distinguish what left and right are, and you
think they know what your inside and outside are on the fly?

That is to say most beginners forget what they have just learned when
the skis start to slide.



No, it is turning on the inside ski; that is, press the right ski
for
right turn and press the left ski for left turn.

The outside ski is the outside ski all the way around the turn.
Same with the inside ski. Simple. It has to be kept simple.


Nothing [in skiing] simpler than press the right ski to turn right, and
press left ski to turn left, and that is flat-boarding.


IS

"yunlong" wrote in message

Nonsense, so you think that only the terminology you used is correct,
and another people's terminology is crap?

Crap it is.

Just tell 'em, no more uphill downhill.

Why? Uphill/downhill are not the natural environment of skiing?

There's nothing wrong with uphill/downhill terminology; just because
you are confused with it doesn't mean it is invalid.

Yun, I've skied for 30 years and I had to stop and think about what uphill
and downhill meant in terms of weighting and unweighting through a turn. It
changes 3 times in the course of any turn if your thinking uphill and
downhill. Your explanation leaves me thinking I might have to change my
weight 3 times each turn, when in fact it should one fluid motion.
(basically). Inside and outside OTOH, was obvious. And it stays the same
until you begin the next turn.
The walking in a circle analogy was excellent. I have been trying for years
to come up with such a clear way to explain it to my kids.





Really? Did you tell them to use "inside/outside ski" or
"left/right
ski/foot"?

I described it earlier. Walk in a circle and have them ID the
inside and outside feet. Left or right is not relevant it would
only confuse.

Still "walking," eh? The question was how do they "ski"?

With the kids who cannot distinguish what left and right are, and you
think they know what your inside and outside are on the fly?


I picture a kid having a LOT less trouble UNDERSTANDING inside and out than
REMEMBERING left and right.


That is to say most beginners forget what they have just learned when
the skis start to slide.



No, it is turning on the inside ski; that is, press the right ski
for
right turn and press the left ski for left turn.

The outside ski is the outside ski all the way around the turn.
Same with the inside ski. Simple. It has to be kept simple.


Nothing [in skiing] simpler than press the right ski to turn right, and
press left ski to turn left, and that is flat-boarding.


Sure. If you did it that way. Have you ever actually skied Yun?

Mary Malmros wrote:
BssnRX wrote:

No, it is turning on the inside ski; that is, press the right ski
for
right turn and press the left ski for left turn.


You press on the right ski to turn right and the left ski to turn
left? hmmm

Yes, the inside ski turns, and that's the essence of flat-boarding.


God, don't you love terminology confusions? Then everybody can be
right
and "know" that everybody else is wrong ;-)

And get themselves so confused ever?


In the normal world, a "right turn" means turning to the right and a
"left turn" means turning to the left. I would expect the same terms
to
mean the same things in skiing (although you don't typically hear
people
saying, "make a right turn"), but there may be a confusion with the
terms "right-footer" and "left-footer". A "right-footer" is actually
a
left-hand turn, and vice versa.

Outside ski turns? No, that is not what I meant;

"everybody can be right and 'know' that everybody else is wrong"? Yup,
the nature of egotism.


IS


--
Mary Malmros
Some days you're the windshield, other days you're the bug.

"BssnRX" wrote in message

No, it is turning on the inside ski; that is, press the right ski for
right turn and press the left ski for left turn.

You press on the right ski to turn right and the left ski to turn left?
hmmm

Yah, Yun was fun, for a while, but his troll is showing now.
And to think I got so excited by the converstaiton that
I misspelled wordz.

Push on that foot to go that way
and that footto go that way

He claims he's talking about turning on the inside ski, not the
outside. I had an eight year old that insisted on doing this. I
didn't feel all that bad, he did make the goal of parallel within
two hours. I spent almost all last year doing this, trying to learn
to ski on only one ski. Of course, I was only doing it half the
time. There's nothing that says you can't, if you're thoroughly
crossed over. If not, you'll dust off the snow with your body.

If Yun seriously thinks he'll get ahead of the game by
teaching beginners of any age to ski that way, however,
he's insane. My beginners will shred your beginners Yun.
My beginners will make your beginners look like fools.
Talk about learning long....

"Norm" wrote in message
news:lgltd.458298$%k.282825@pd7tw2no...

Yun, I've skied for 30 years and I had to stop and think about what uphill
and downhill meant in terms of weighting and unweighting through a turn.
It
changes 3 times in the course of any turn if your thinking uphill and
downhill. Your explanation leaves me thinking I might have to change my
weight 3 times each turn, when in fact it should one fluid motion.
(basically). Inside and outside OTOH, was obvious. And it stays the same
until you begin the next turn.
The walking in a circle analogy was excellent. I have been trying for
years
to come up with such a clear way to explain it to my kids.

Thnx. Draw the circle ask kid to point to inside of circle. Then
walk each direction, clock and counter, ID feet inside and
outside, then don't forget the S- turn walk down the hill, ID
outside foot with each direction change. That really clinches it.

PSIA always hits the ceiling when I then tell the kid (or adult)
to put *all* the weight on the outside ski, but really, that's
one of the key things to super fast learning of parallel turns.

Any concrete thinker can do this. That generally means
about six years and above.

Once again, the magical thinkers are just a roll of the dice,
anything you can try, consider yourself lucky if they learn
whatever they learn.

BTW, the latest issue of PSIA's snow pro mag has
both writers in and ed's in the letters to the editor section
stumbling over what to call the edges. Please. It's pinky
(or little toe) edge and big toe edge. Always is. Actually it's
pinky ball and big toe ball of the foot. But that might confuse
somebody. Let's hope the ed's read RSA.

I picture a kid having a LOT less trouble UNDERSTANDING inside and out
than
REMEMBERING left and right.

Thanks again Norm : .

yunlong wrote:
foot2foot wrote:

"yunlong" wrote in message
groups.com...

Likewise, I encountered more people confused on "inside/outside"
terminology than people used "uphill/downhill."

You've encountered people who were raised on that crap.
You have to be rutheless here.


Nonsense, so you think that only the terminology you used is correct,
and another people's terminology is crap?

Crap it is.


Just tell 'em, no more uphill downhill.


Why? Uphill/downhill are not the natural environment of skiing?

There's nothing wrong with uphill/downhill terminology; just because
you are confused with it doesn't mean it is invalid.

Uphill/downhill will confuse the heck out of new skiers - *all* new
skiers. Especially when you explain that half way through a turn the
uphill becomes the downhill and the downhill becomes the uphill. They
might as well turn in their skis and go back to the lodge.

Take it from somehow who still remembers when they were learning how to
ski. The uphill/downhill terminology was abandoned for good reason.

"foot2foot" wrote in message


PSIA always hits the ceiling when I then tell the kid (or adult)
to put *all* the weight on the outside ski, but really, that's
one of the key things to super fast learning of parallel turns.

To tell them anything other than all the weight would be to assume they
already have balance, initiation, etc all down pat already. Once they can
turn then they may be able to move on to place whatever % weight outside and
the rest inside, but until then its just confusing them with something they
are not capable of accomplishing, and have no need of at this level.



Any concrete thinker can do this. That generally means
about six years and above.

Once again, the magical thinkers are just a roll of the dice,
anything you can try, consider yourself lucky if they learn
whatever they learn.

BTW, the latest issue of PSIA's snow pro mag has
both writers in and ed's in the letters to the editor section
stumbling over what to call the edges. Please. It's pinky
(or little toe) edge and big toe edge. Always is. Actually it's
pinky ball and big toe ball of the foot. But that might confuse
somebody. Let's hope the ed's read RSA.

I picture a kid having a LOT less trouble UNDERSTANDING inside and out
than
REMEMBERING left and right.

Thanks again Norm : .

Me too.

"Chuck" wrote in message
...
yunlong wrote:
foot2foot wrote:

"yunlong" wrote in message
groups.com...

Likewise, I encountered more people confused on "inside/outside"
terminology than people used "uphill/downhill."

You've encountered people who were raised on that crap.
You have to be rutheless here.


Nonsense, so you think that only the terminology you used is correct,
and another people's terminology is crap?

Crap it is.


Just tell 'em, no more uphill downhill.


Why? Uphill/downhill are not the natural environment of skiing?

There's nothing wrong with uphill/downhill terminology; just because
you are confused with it doesn't mean it is invalid.

Uphill/downhill will confuse the heck out of new skiers - *all* new
skiers. Especially when you explain that half way through a turn the
uphill becomes the downhill and the downhill becomes the uphill. They
might as well turn in their skis and go back to the lodge.

Take it from somehow who still remembers when they were learning how to
ski. The uphill/downhill terminology was abandoned for good reason.

"Norm" wrote in message

"foot2foot" wrote in message


PSIA always hits the ceiling when I then tell the kid (or adult)
to put *all* the weight on the outside ski, but really, that's
one of the key things to super fast learning of parallel turns.

To tell them anything other than all the weight would be to assume they
already have balance, initiation, etc all down pat already. Once they can
turn then they may be able to move on to place whatever % weight outside
and
the rest inside, but until then its just confusing them with something
they
are not capable of accomplishing, and have no need of at this level.

Exactly. A person needs to be able to ski with all the weight
on one foot as well as with all the weight equally balanced
on both feet. There's no crime in learning to place *most all
of* (which is all they end up doing anyway) the weight on one
ski first.

The arguments cited against it are that you're teaching the
student something they'll have to "unlearn", or some other
("*far* superior") instructor will have to "unteach" (ridiculous,
really), and that the beginner can't place all the weight on one
ski. Also, it's argued that a beginner can't pick up the tail of a
ski. But they can, they do it all day, every day there's snow
on the hill, and when they do, they learn parallel in a *real*
hurry.