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Buying the right avalanche transceiver?
Hi all,
As I am becoming a more avid backcountry rider during recent seasons, I am now in dire need of my own transceiver. However, I have no idea what to look for or what features are necessities. I definitely need something that has plenty of features at the best price (of course!) but also, as I haven't found a local dealer yet, can be sourced from the internet. Thanks in advance for any advice you can give! -Nick V |
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In article .com, wrote: Hi all, As I am becoming a more avid backcountry rider during recent seasons, I am now in dire need of my own transceiver. However, I have no idea what to look for or what features are necessities. I definitely need something that has plenty of features at the best price (of course!) but also, as I haven't found a local dealer yet, can be sourced from the internet. Thanks in advance for any advice you can give! -Nick V _ This may be considered heresy, but IMHO an avalanche transciever is the LAST thing you need. Avalanche education is the FIRST. A transciever is a device of last resort, a last chance grab at survival after mistakes have been made. It's much better to focus on not making mistakes in the first place. Take some classes and get some experience with the ones in the classes and you'll be much better off when you need to buy your own. _ IMHO, excessive features are the last thing you need on a transciever. If you're using one in anger, every last second counts and the more things that can go wrong the more that will go wrong. Get the simplest to use possible, since you, like me and everybody else, won't really practice enough with it to make any extra features anything but an encumberance. _ The gear articles here are a little out of date, but there is much good info to consider http://www.couloirmag.com/articles/avy_index.htm _ Booker C. Bense -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: 2.6.2 iQCVAwUBQ0GBlWTWTAjn5N/lAQGSCQP/WKyUYZvUOI9xv4HHRIDmtZl9qvNln/1b ibJpauH6p2+KHPGqyL8gCKA/Ab0zIF6JmcXW/IujqbQFDPqh73yC0uZ71QFiC2Yn xSQXxgmL1O1XxB5VxNOxujn1llJlPZAh2Vs43gxfZpuu6YNF+4 W7otfqOf3OMBcS y7wl51b89T8= =guax -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- |
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Booker C. Bense schrieb:
_ This may be considered heresy, but IMHO an avalanche transciever is the LAST thing you need. Avalanche education is the FIRST. A transciever is a device of last resort, a last chance grab at survival after mistakes have been made. It's much better to focus on not making mistakes in the first place. Take some classes and get some experience with the ones in the classes and you'll be much better off when you need to buy your own. No heresy at all, but absolutely correct. _ IMHO, excessive features are the last thing you need on a transciever. If you're using one in anger, every last second counts and the more things that can go wrong the more that will go wrong. Get the simplest to use possible, since you, like me and everybody else, won't really practice enough with it to make any extra features anything but an encumberance. Here, i've a slightly different point of view: You should get a transceiver which does a good moltiple persons rescue distinction (and that ones, normally are those with more features) - and hopefully, you'll never use it. Our experience is: Tracker is very easy to use, but has a little bit weak signal, Barryvox (Mammut) has the better signal, but it's slightly more complicated. The simplest (digital) but also very valid is the french ARVA. As for us here in Europe: Most in early winter do a 1-2 days training in rescueing, use of transceiver, crevasse salvatage ecc. Very likely and hopefully, you will never have to use that kind of knowledge, but it's good to have ... :-) Greetings, Ulrich |
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In article , Uli Hausmann wrote: As for us here in Europe: Most in early winter do a 1-2 days training in rescueing, use of transceiver, crevasse salvatage ecc. Very likely and hopefully, you will never have to use that kind of knowledge, but it's good to have ... :-) _ Well, I suspect that's way more than most NA skiers do. Crevasses aren't really an issue in 99.9% of the backcountry skiing in the lower 48 states. Based on my experience I would recommend the Tracker, since people with absolutely no training have used it to rescue others and every fall I can find my old Pieps with it without reading the instruction manual. _ Booker C. Bense -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: 2.6.2 iQCVAwUBQ0GxoGTWTAjn5N/lAQEJZgP/S0dj2dlQ6m5KGpurFdwc6SLPEHieWsBB TTmchiYls4C7+Dbp9u3D6w8q7B0IPwIrgZGaukDy8oKp6XytbR Qmea4xeFq4s7Rr /TaO/oVbekRQtKs1vV358ishatMZu1UR9gdM15IkEKVwqdqdCvqoJYl jT827DxSI UrRaxxhPilE= =bgOS -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- |
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Booker C. Bense wrote:
Based on my experience I would recommend the Tracker, since people with absolutely no training have used it to rescue others and every fall I can find my old Pieps with it without reading the instruction manual. Our XC ski club bought the local MRT's old Pieps at bargain rates for club use when the team upgraded their own kit to Trackers, so that's what the local pros are using here. If money is an issue you can now get 2nd hand Pieps or similar for a (relative) song and they will do the job, but when it comes to searching there is no question that the new digital units are much easier, especially if you're sorting out multiple burials. Hmmm, probably should start to think about trading up my own Pieps at some point... Pete. -- Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK net http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/ |
#7
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In message
Peter Clinch wrote: Booker C. Bense wrote: Based on my experience I would recommend the Tracker, since people with absolutely no training have used it to rescue others and every fall I can find my old Pieps with it without reading the instruction manual. Our XC ski club bought the local MRT's old Pieps at bargain rates for club use when the team upgraded their own kit to Trackers, so that's what the local pros are using here. If money is an issue you can now get 2nd hand Pieps or similar for a (relative) song and they will do the job, but when it comes to searching there is no question that the new digital units are much easier, especially if you're sorting out multiple burials. Hmmm, probably should start to think about trading up my own Pieps at some point... Pete. I've been using an analogue Ortovox F1 or F1 focus for all the years that I've been ski-touring. If I was buying new transceiver today I'd probably consider a digital or a combined digital/analogue device but I recognise that if I did buy a different model I'd probably have to put in extra hours next season in familiarising myself with it. Thus the most important thing as far as I'm concerned is to practice using your own device to the point where you are able to quickly and efficiently use it to locate other transmitters in a variety of conditions and situations. I probably spend about half a day each season doing such practice. Whilst the newer digital models do make it slightly easier to carry out searches for multiple buried transmitters, there are appropriate methods for using analogue devices that will be perfectly adequate, you just need to know what works well for your own device. When I've practised alongside my friends some of whom use digital transceivers there hasn't been a consistent or noticeable difference in our individual effectiveness in finding single or multiple burials. For most skiers like myself the key thing as has been pointed out earlier in the thread is to minimise exposure to risk by becoming aware of the dangers. Carrying a transceiver and shovel should be regarded as a default for any serious off-piste or ski-tour, but it's important not to risk compensate by believing it will definitely offer a great deal of protection. Number one priority is to avoid the avalanche in the first place. Thus really the important priorities for such skiers are (a) that the transmitter is reliable and sends out a strong signal if you are buried and (b) that the members of the group are confident in their abilities to use their own transceivers for searching. I think when it comes to transceivers for professionals, such as members of SAR, or those who work as Mountain Guides, different considerations do come into play. They are most likely to have to use their transceivers on a regular basis and in all kinds of extreme circumstance. For them features probably do matter even if they only add marginal improvements. But they also have the time and experience to practice and to compare and contrast different equipment under different conditions. Some years ago a friend in my climbing club was from Grenoble and worked for several years in the Chamonix rescue services (sadly and ironically he was killed in an avalanche that hit a road when he was out skiing with a group of his local friends), he used an analogue device but had practised and used it for SAR so often that he could simply switch it to receive and immediately tell you how many people in the group had their transceivers switched on, what models of transceiver they were wearing, and also have an idea about how fresh their batteries were. But to get to that level of skill you need to be practising and using the device nearly every day. Most of us don't and won't. Mike -- o/ \\ // |\ ,_ o Mike Clark \__,\\ // __o | \ / /\, "A mountain climbing, cycling, skiing, " || _`\,_ |__\ \ | immunology lecturer, antibody engineer and ` || (_)/ (_) | \corn computer user" |
#8
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-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
In article , Mike Clark wrote: For most skiers like myself the key thing as has been pointed out earlier in the thread is to minimise exposure to risk by becoming aware of the dangers. Carrying a transceiver and shovel should be regarded as a default for any serious off-piste or ski-tour, but it's important not to risk compensate by believing it will definitely offer a great deal of protection. _ Personally, I believe this to be next to impossible. If you have partners and beacons, your decision making will be affected. There's a very interesting article reprint in the most recent Couloir about the effects of group size on risk taking. There's many other interesting observations as well. _ Booker C. Bense -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: 2.6.2 iQCVAwUBQ0LDmmTWTAjn5N/lAQE6pAP/Q7hLz0bVNrIEsMOIoII4syZXlMmJzMoU Rq7SQsC2g73WvV0BG6OStYUdhavpvHXhj/yxdAalEiTa7VAsE6fTceYzBAvLFpOj y4dvpH/o6kGOoFkD9XLrAy8hVAre0J0BmDW9Al7qckIZfpDWT7yLT3rI4 S3KlWid HOx51OLfs/E= =7wwt -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- |
#9
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I've got one of the new Pieps tripple antenna jobs. Not sure how they fare
in objective testing, but I had no problems locating multiple beacons just farting around. I doubt that the features for isolating different beacons is foolproof (gotta be some tolerance in which the receiver can't distinguish between two beacons that are close in frequency), but it did work well the one time I tried it. Locating a single beacon seemed prettty much as easy at the Tracker. The Pieps boasts better range, though. Anyway, it was just a single subjective test on my part, but it seems like a decent unit. wrote in message oups.com... Hi all, As I am becoming a more avid backcountry rider during recent seasons, I am now in dire need of my own transceiver. However, I have no idea what to look for or what features are necessities. I definitely need something that has plenty of features at the best price (of course!) but also, as I haven't found a local dealer yet, can be sourced from the internet. Thanks in advance for any advice you can give! -Nick V |
#10
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Uli Hausmann wrote in news:43417e2e$0$26207$9b4e6d93
@newsread2.arcor-online.net: schrieb: Hi all, As I am becoming a more avid backcountry rider during recent seasons, I am now in dire need of my own transceiver. However, I have no idea what to look for or what features are necessities. I definitely need something that has plenty of features at the best price (of course!) but also, as I haven't found a local dealer yet, can be sourced from the internet. Thanks in advance for any advice you can give! Getting Mammut or Tracker you won't fail. But also most (digitals) of the other brands are good. Greetings, Ulrich I'd put in a cautious vote for the Mammut, if you're not experienced. Last season during a practice session I had a complete beginner find a buried transciever using a Mammut unit as quickly as I could (I can fairly consistently beat 5 minutes for a single transciever, if I start above, using my F1 Focus). I say a cautious vote because later in the same session the Mammut unit stopped working and gave some kind of error we coudln't figure out. I suspect it was a low battery warning rather than a malfunction, but as we didn't have the manual and none of the party were very experienced with these units we didn't know for sure. As others have commented, whichever you choose it's important that you know it well. Jeremy |
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