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#21
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"lonerider" wrote in message
oups.com... Robert Stevahn wrote: On Tue, 15 Mar 2005 11:00:37 -0800, "Bob" wrote: I used to crew for a league race operation. The boarders best times were always way higher than the better skiers. I wonder why the sanctioning bodies give handicaps to boarders and telemarkers, then? In our one league race this year (before they cancelled due to lack of snow), the two boarders were several seconds slower than the fastest skiers on the GS course. -- Robert I think he is providing evidence supporting you claim... notice he says best times were way "higher," which if you think about it... means "slower" I had to re-read the post a bunch of times before getting that myself. So yea, I personally have found that a skiier at a particular level of ability will be faster down the slope than a comparable snowboarder - that is just a general rule. Skiers can get more air out of the pipe than a comparable 'boarder as well. |
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#22
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On 15 Mar 2005 11:25:21 -0800, "lonerider"
wrote: I think he is providing evidence supporting you claim... notice he says best times were way "higher," Doh! My bad. -- Robert |
#23
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Wow its turned into what I guess it would turn out to be. A ****ing
match. I am a snowboarder and I have yet to see a snowboard exceed the speed of skiis. Its quite simple, actually (and true!) Skii's take up less surface area. Less surface area == less friction == more speed. There really is no arguing that. Now whether or not you're matching up the right people to compare this theory is another matter which may be impossible to prove in that sense. Try the theory on ice while you're at it so you can get in the Guinness Book. Just wear a helmet |
#24
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"fotoobscura" wrote Skii's take up less surface area. Less surface area == less friction == more speed. There really is no arguing that. Now whether or not you're matching up the right people to compare this theory is another matter which may be impossible to prove in that sense. 1. Skis have less surface area? Where did that come from? 2. Less surface area == less friction? Where did that come from? In my experience for a snowboarder and a skier of the comparable level what a person likes and does most determines who'll be the first to the bottom. I won't argue that in all-out racing skis are a much better tool than a snowboard, but for people who are not racing equipment isn't that much of a factor. I've got skier friends who are better than me level-wise and are in better shape, yet I wait for them more they wait for me just because they like going slow where I like going fast. Works vice-versa too, I know a guy who skis pretty poorly and yet he'll be the first to the bottom on everything but the gnariest terrain just because he can muscle his way down and enjoys that quite a bit. |
#25
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"Dean" wrote in message ... Bryan wrote: And why do boarders sit down in the middle of runs? There are two questions: Why do they sit? Why do they sit in the middle of runs? After great consideration I've concluded that the answer is: Because they can and standing still on a board is very difficult. Sitting with skis probably isn't realistic which is why some skiers stand in the middle of runs. If you want to know why they sit in the middle of runs to socialize rather than sitting on a side, that's probably because they are young and aren't thinking. I don't see older boarders sitting in the middle of runs. We go to the edge to sit and sooth our aching legs and wobbly knees or to admire the view. I've had to tell kids at the top of hills, The common element is "young" and "inexperienced". Vans pull into the resorts, kids get out, and the vans leave. The ski patrol is not a substitute for parental supervision and training. Dean Nice answer! |
#26
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"Robert Stevahn" wrote in message ... On Tue, 15 Mar 2005 05:10:30 GMT, "Bryan" wrote: I was thinking that he would probably have more fun riding than skiing. That however is based on the assumption (out of total ingnorance) that snowboarders spend most of their day at the terrain parks and pipes. There are all kinds of boarders and all kinds of skiiers. I ride with both, but obviously gravitate toward those who enjoy the same sort of things I do. It's no problem boarding with skiiers, although expert skiiers will get down the mountain faster than expert boarders. If he's happy with skis, get him a pair of twin tips and he'll find plenty of company in the park. -- Robert Well guys, thanks for all the great feedback. Some great answers to things I was thinking about. Seriously! |
#27
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fotoobscura wrote: Wow its turned into what I guess it would turn out to be. A ****ing match. Actually if you read the posts more carefully, everyone is in agreement. Skis tend to be faster. I am a snowboarder and I have yet to see a snowboard exceed the speed of skiis. Its quite simple, actually (and true!) Like I said, it is possible... but usually it's a snowboarder who is a level or two higher than the skiier you are comparing with. |
#28
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fotoobscura wrote:
Skii's take up less surface area. Less surface area == less friction == more speed. There really is no arguing that. Actually there's quite a lot of arguing that. I don't deny that skis are faster, better racing tools but surface area isn't the reason. In fact, my 200 cm Tanker snowboard has more surface area than any other snow tool I can think of off-hand but in terms of pure glide it stomps all over most skis. This is measured by the number of people I pass just gliding by on cat tracks. Downhill racers are looking for the most speed but use the longest, widest skis. As far as who's fastest down the hill in recreational mode - depends entirely on conditions. If it's an icy bump run, the skier probably wins. If it's waist deep powder and I'm on the Tanker - sayonara, baby. But most of all, it's the driver, not the equipment. I pass damn near everybody, skiis or snowboard. That's why my wife made me get a helmet. Neil |
#29
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fotoobscura wrote:
Skii's take up less surface area. Less surface area == less friction == more speed. There really is no arguing that. Um....yes there is. Get out your Physics 101 text. Friction force is equal to (weight) x (coefficient of friction). It's independent of surface area. And since ski and snowboard bases are made out of the same materials (ptex) the coefficient of friction is the same. A better explanation of why skis tend to be faster than boards is that long skinny things move through liquid more easily than short wide things, because long skinny things don't have to push as much stuff out of the way. This applies to sailboats, canoes, kayaks, as well as snow sliding equipment. That said, the real mark of accomplisment is not speed itself so much as being able to control your speed. Any geezer can just point straight down the hill and try to hang on. Wow its turned into what I guess it would turn out to be. A ****ing match. Hmmmm. Everyone has been pretty well behaved as far as I can see. Consensus opinion seems to be that as long as both parties have similar taste in terrain and ride/ski at more or less the same speed, what's on the feet isn't really much of an issue. I ski with boarder friends on occasion, and the biggest issue is waiting for them to strap in at the top. -- //-Walt // // There is no Völkl Conspiracy |
#30
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Walt wrote:
fotoobscura wrote: Skii's take up less surface area. Less surface area == less friction == more speed. There really is no arguing that. Um....yes there is. Get out your Physics 101 text. Friction force is equal to (weight) x (coefficient of friction). It's independent of surface area. And since ski and snowboard bases are made out of the same materials (ptex) the coefficient of friction is the same. Yeah, well physics 101 is... inadequate usually, to explain the real world. If the coefficient of friction is all there is to it, then explain why drag racers use big, wide tires. Seems they could save a lot of money using small skinny ones if that simple formula held true all the time. How snowboards and skis interact with the snow surface is probably more fluid dynamics than anything else. It's complex, and I don't claim to know much about it other than it can't be reduced to a coefficient of friction and the weight bearing down on it. Neil |
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