Beginner Equipment choices.

Before I start a little background: I'm moving to Colorado next month... I
live in Illinois now. I've been to the two local shops and was
unimpressed... That's why I'm unleashing the deluge of questions you see
here... I hate people like me... Is there a FAQ somewhere?

With that said; I understand the basic differences between a beginner board
and a pro-level board. I think it would be a detriment to my learning if I
went out and bought a board built for someone far more advanced than I am.

Does the same go for boots? My logic says, 'no, buy a comfortable boot and
binding combo and upgrade the board when it's time'.

Basically correct? Or so far off it's sick?
n.

Before I start a little background: I'm moving to Colorado next month... I
live in Illinois now. I've been to the two local shops and was
unimpressed... That's why I'm unleashing the deluge of questions you see
here... I hate people like me... Is there a FAQ somewhere?

http://rssfaq.org

With that said; I understand the basic differences between a beginner
board
and a pro-level board. I think it would be a detriment to my learning if I
went out and bought a board built for someone far more advanced than I am.

Yes and no.

Yes, some kinds of "pro-level" boards would be a detriment to your learning.
For example, if you get a board that is very specific to one type of riding,
like a board with recessed edges for rails at the expense of holding an edge
on snowor a boardercross board that's built for stability at speed at the
expense of being able to turn it easily when going slower.

However a high-end, all-around freestyle or freeride board that's high-end
becasue it's made from good materials, well designed, and durable might help
you learn better and faster.

Look for something that you won't kill yourself on now but that you won't
outgrow!


Does the same go for boots? My logic says, 'no, buy a comfortable boot and
binding combo and upgrade the board when it's time'.

Basically correct? Or so far off it's sick?

In my opinion you're right on with that appraoch. Buy boots that fit, then
get bidnings that work well with those boots, and use whatever is left on a
board. You can save money on a board by getting leftovers from last year's
models, buying at the end of the season (e.g. right now) or in a few cases
by buying direct from the smaller manufacturers.

Most people find the mid to high end boots are also the ones that tend to
fit the best, but not always. The best time to shop for boots is right
after the shops get stocked up in the fall, when they have the full
selection available.

-Mike T

On Mon, 22 Mar 2004 04:25:43 GMT, "Nathan Otis"
wrote:

Before I start a little background: I'm moving to Colorado next month... I
live in Illinois now. I've been to the two local shops and was
unimpressed... That's why I'm unleashing the deluge of questions you see
here... I hate people like me... Is there a FAQ somewhere?

With that said; I understand the basic differences between a beginner board
and a pro-level board. I think it would be a detriment to my learning if I
went out and bought a board built for someone far more advanced than I am.

Does the same go for boots? My logic says, 'no, buy a comfortable boot and
binding combo and upgrade the board when it's time'.

Basically correct? Or so far off it's sick?
n.


1st purchase should be made for boots...get the most expensive boots
you can afford....chances are you will out grow your board( bindings)
way before you outgrow the boots...unless you are a young teen or
something like that..

Generally beginner boards are softer with more flex...makes it easier
to initiate turns but not soo stable at higher speeds..

I've considered your statements and questions. My questions and opinions are
below.


Nathan Otis wrote:

Before I start a little background: I'm moving to Colorado next month... I
live in Illinois now

What is your age? You do not need to answer in public. The reason for the
question is to determine if you are still growing. You have to decide if you
want to spend $400-$500 on a good board if your body will outgrow it in a year
or two.

Keep in mind that the hills in the midwest are not the same as the mountains in
the west. I also live in the midwest, and we have short, groomed hills that
usually have little variation in terrain from top to bottom.


With that said; I understand the basic differences between a beginner board
and a pro-level board. I think it would be a detriment to my learning if I
went out and bought a board built for someone far more advanced than I am.

I think I disagree with your statement, but I am not sure. It depends upon what
you mean by "pro-level" board. There are multiple meanings and I do not know
what you consider a "pro-level" board. You might mean a board specialized for a
single type of boarding. Or perhaps you mean a board that uses the latest and
most expensive technologies. Or maybe you mean something else.

There are different types of boarding and there are different types of boards.
Some boards are specialized for the different types of boarding. Some boards
are compromises that will be okay but not the best in multiple environments. If
you have questions you want a sales person who is a boarder and knows the
difference between different types of boarding. Some sales people are boarders
but only live in one environment, such as a terrain park.

A specialized terrain park board isn't going to make a great powder board, for
example. Some boards will be okay in a terrain park and on groomed hills, but
won't be the best board for either situation, which is often fine for the
short, groomed hills of the midwest.

Do you know what type of boarding you want to do? If not, then starting with a
multiple purpose board would probably be best. After a while you might want a
board specialized for a particular type of boarding. If you plan to board under
multiple conditions you might want multiple, specialized boards. For example,
you might want to be a half pipe pro and also board in 3 foot deep powder.


Does the same go for boots? My logic says, 'no, buy a comfortable boot and
binding combo and upgrade the board when it's time'.

Get the best boots you can find that correspond with the type of boarding that
you plan to do. You will be on your feet constantly. The problem is defining
"best". Best does not necessarily mean the most costly. I recently upgraded my
boots. I say that my new boots are an upgrade because they fit better. By "fit
better" I do not mean they are more comfortable, I mean they have more
adjustments for creating and keeping a snug fit while remaining comfortable and
they have the amount of stiffness that I want. I bought them on sale, and they
cost the same as my first pair, but they are much better (list $300, on sale
for under $200).

Try on many brands and models within a brand. Don't let a sales person push you
into a particular brand or model. Don't buy something just because it is low
cost or on sale.

Dean

I've considered your questions and opinions... :-) Read on.

Before I start a little background: I'm moving to Colorado next month...
I
live in Illinois now

What is your age? You do not need to answer in public. The reason for the
question is to determine if you are still growing. You have to decide if
you
want to spend $400-$500 on a good board if your body will outgrow it in a
year
or two.

I'm thirty. I haven't grown an inch since I was 18

Keep in mind that the hills in the midwest are not the same as the
mountains in
the west. I also live in the midwest, and we have short, groomed hills
that
usually have little variation in terrain from top to bottom.

Understood. I've visited CO twice in the last three years and I'm well
aquainted with the differences in terrain... However, I'm not buying for use
in Illinois, I'm moving to Parker, Co in April!! (WOO!)

I think I disagree with your statement, but I am not sure. It depends upon
what
you mean by "pro-level" board. There are multiple meanings and I do not
know
what you consider a "pro-level" board. You might mean a board specialized
for a
single type of boarding. Or perhaps you mean a board that uses the latest
and
most expensive technologies. Or maybe you mean something else.

What I meant was, maybe a "pro" board would turn sharper and be too fast for
me to learn on. That kind of thing.

snip some educational stuff
Do you know what type of boarding you want to do? If not, then starting
with a
multiple purpose board would probably be best. After a while you might
want a
board specialized for a particular type of boarding. If you plan to board
under
multiple conditions you might want multiple, specialized boards. For
example,
you might want to be a half pipe pro and also board in 3 foot deep powder.

In general I think I'll be looking for an all-mountain kind of board for
general riding, some small jumps and aggressive stuff later as I progress.
Powder intrigues me but as yet I have no experience in it.

Does the same go for boots? My logic says, 'no, buy a comfortable boot
and
binding combo and upgrade the board when it's time'.

Get the best boots you can find that correspond with the type of boarding
that
you plan to do.

How does one determine this?

I recently upgraded my boots. I say that my new boots are an upgrade
because they fit better. By "fit
better" I do not mean they are more comfortable, I mean they have more
adjustments for creating and keeping a snug fit while remaining
comfortable and
they have the amount of stiffness that I want. I bought them on sale, and
they
cost the same as my first pair, but they are much better (list $300, on
sale
for under $200).

Care to let me in on what terrain you ride and what your equipment setup is?
(I understand if you want to take this discussion to e-mail and avoid a
possible "Brand-Xyz-sux-donkey-how-can-you-ride-that-crap?!" kind of
situation).

Thanks for the words.
n.

Nathan Otis wrote:

I'm thirty. I haven't grown an inch since I was 18

Understood. I've visited CO twice in the last three years and I'm well
aquainted with the differences in terrain... However, I'm not buying for use
in Illinois, I'm moving to Parker, Co in April!! (WOO!)

Exactly. The boards sold by most stores in IL/WI are probably more suitable for
the short, groomed hills and terrain parks of the midwest than the mountains of
the west, and aimed at 15 year olds who want to slide over rails. Most are not
all-mountain boards. Many are holdovers from previous years. This winter was
good, and some stores sold nearly all merchandise. The previous years had
little snow and stores were left with a lot of merchandise. Many purchased
little new stock for 2003/2004.


What I meant was, maybe a "pro" board would turn sharper and be too fast for
me to learn on. That kind of thing.

That should not be an issue. No matter what board you have the incline of the
hill or the quality of the snow won't change.

Get the best boots you can find that correspond with the type of boarding
that
you plan to do.

How does one determine this?

I recommend reading the FAQ and books and talking with others just as you are
doing. There are some good books on the market that cover equipment, technique,
lifts, etc.


Care to let me in on what terrain you ride and what your equipment setup is?
(I understand if you want to take this discussion to e-mail and avoid a
possible "Brand-Xyz-sux-donkey-how-can-you-ride-that-crap?!" kind of
situation).

Briefly:

I'm not an expert, meaning that I have not boarded big mountains, raced, jumped
(very high :-), used a half pipe or used lots of different equipment brands.
I've been to most resorts in Wisconsin and a few in Michigan. I'm 48. This was
my second year of boarding. I never downhilled skied. I learned a lot this year
and managed to get down some black diamond hills without wrecking myself or
anyone else. I did zig when I should have zagged once and tumbled
head-over-heels two or three times before stopping. It probably looked far worse
than it was. I had no injuries, other than my dignity, and I simply popped back
up after I stopped tumbling and continued down the hill. I wear a helmet.

I took a lesson at a local hill. The instructor was a teenager who could board
but had no clue how to teach, and the hill was icy. I rented equipment twice
that was so bad I decided to buy my own. (The resort had exactly one pair of
boots that fit me.) I didn't know a fraction of what I now know about equipment.
Fortunately the sales people did a fairly good job, meaning they didn't try to
sell me something that would not be anywhere near right for me. They were adults
and boarders. I purchased equipment from two local stores. I got the board and
bindings from one store and the boots from another because the first store
didn't have boots that felt right. I read a couple of books, found a better hill
and started having fun.

Old Equipment

- K2 Fatbob 158 board (wide board for my size 11.5 feet) (2000/2001 model I
think. The store had it for a couple of years and slashed the price.)

- Salomon Dialogue boots. Salomon fit my feet better than the other brands that
I tried. However, that may not be the case for you because different people have
differently shaped feet.

- Flow FL-4 bindings. I hated the rental strap bindings. I spent more time
buckling and unbuckling on the short hills than I did going down the hills. When
I saw the Flow bindings I knew I had found the right thing for my situation. As
the ads say, your mileage may vary.

New Equipment

- Giro Fuse helmet (has adjustable vents that open/close with a lever)
- Donek Wide 161 board
- Flow Pro 11 bindings
- Salomon Malamute boots

Why the Donek board? I'd read good things about it and wanted an all-mountain
board, and I like small companies that do what they do very well and will
provide personal service. Plus you can pick your own color and/or graphics. I
had problems with quick edge-to-edge transitions. I say that based on what I saw
others doing. Others could switch edges must faster than me. I figured it was
either the board, my crappy knees or my technique. I've had the Donek for about
a week and used it one day so far. It seemed much more responsive than the K2
and plowed through some situations that caused the K2 to bounce. I moved it with
less effort then I used with the K2. The Donek is longer and slightly narrower
than the K2.

There are lots of boards. You should opportunities to demo several in CO
compared to little to no opportunities in IL and WI.

I don't like plain, straight hills. I like variable terrain, not just going
fast. I like the G force from sharp turns. I'm at a lack for words to concisely
describe it other than to say that I like to get off the beaten trail, which is
pretty hard to do in my area. I got to board on 5" of fresh snow once this year,
and loved it. All other times the groomers had packed the snow before I got on
the hill. I've gone through terrain parks, but to zip around the features like a
slalom course, not to go over them. One of the most interesting runs at Alpine
Valley in WI, in my opinion, also happens to be the terrain park. The run winds
through the woods rather than being a clearcut hill.

Get a lock. The resort I visited on Sunday had a sign that said that 17 boards
had been stolen so far this year.

Dean