Advanced riders using bum pads?

I have been riding them for 6 seasons - the Reds. They are one of the
best investments ever, and have enabled me to shake off hits that would
have been very painfull. I also wear a set of 323 Snow foam kneepads,
which have also been great. Other benefits besides impact protection -

Extra insulation when sitting or kneeling on snow, cold benches, etc.
Increased confidence
muscle support (quads, etc)

Here's the thing - if it makes you uncomfortable, just don't tell
others that you are rockin' them. Unless you are wearing tight gear, no
one can tell anyway.

Trust me when I say that being sidelined due to injury is far worse
than any amount of laughing from some kid trying to be "core".

Lastly, about the falling - DO NOT LEARN TO FALL ON YOUR ELBOWS!!!!!
A fall to the elbow can potentially shatter it, as well as giving you a
horrific, surgery-needing rotator cuff injury that could nag you for
years. I suggest that you learn to fall on your back and to roll when
falling forward. How can you learn that? Try an introductory aikido or
judo class or read a book about "Ukemi"( art of falling). This is a
serious suggestion; falling properly is a real skill that must be
practiced so that it becomes automatic, and is well worth your time.
Good Luck!

www.skeletools.com

Thank you for the tip though I think they all look heavy duty.

Apart from the Torso Tool being designed predominanty for males
(judging from the photos), can I ask who would use something like that
? Surely you would have to be doing something rather insane to justify
this ? http://www.skeletools.com/torso.html
Have you used such torso protection before?

I'm asking because in addition to the tailbone, my next most frequent
injury is to the shoulder. Every season there's one fall where the
force of the impact goes straight through my arms to the back of my
shoulders or even my neck and it's just sore for the rest of the trip.
Each subsequent fall is then agony.

I think I will get the Short Protector Plus for my tailbone and bum in
the meantime though. Thank you very much for the help.

Heather

Hi Aegis,

Thanks for the tips on the Reds too. OK, now I have to make a decision
between them and the Dainese. Unfortunately I have to order online and
can not try before I buy

Lastly, about the falling - DO NOT LEARN TO FALL ON YOUR ELBOWS!!!!!
A fall to the elbow can potentially shatter it, as well as giving you
a
horrific, surgery-needing rotator cuff injury that could nag you for
years.

Thank you for mentioning this.

As I mentioned in an earlier reply my shoulders (rotator cuffs?) are
where
the worst injuries occur year in and year out. When I first started,
nobody
really taught me how to fall but I quickly learned that falling with a
straight, out-stretched arm was the worst way to fall ! The shock went
all the way up my arm and it felt like my shoulder had been knocked
out of its joint !

So then another friend taught me to fall onto my forearms when
falling forward. I was also told to fall onto elbow falling backwards
but I get some terribly jarring injuries which shoot up into the back
of my neck that way so I'm willing to try anything new to prevent that.



I suggest that you learn to fall on your back

I can see this working when I'm travelling faster since it is more
of a skid or slide along the surface. However, most of the more
painful incidents actually happen when I fall at slow speed on
relative flats when I'm trying some freestyle ground work.
That is a long way to fall from the vertical.

and to roll when falling forward.

Rolling with a snowboard attached to the feet?

How can you learn that? Try an introductory aikido or
judo class or read a book about "Ukemi"( art of falling). This is a
serious suggestion; falling properly is a real skill that must be
practiced so that it becomes automatic, and is well worth your time.

Thank you for this suggestion. I WILL take it seriously because
my holidays are usually ruined by the shoulder injuries which
then cause me to be not so brave.

Heather

Heather wrote:
I'm asking because in addition to the tailbone, my next most frequent
injury is to the shoulder. Every season there's one fall where the
force of the impact goes straight through my arms to the back of my

I've been riding for about 10 years and have hurt my tail bone
and my back before, but never my wrists/arms/shoulders. I'd
suggest never using your arms on purpose to 'help' a fall. If
you can maybe take a tumbling class or a martial arts class that
emphasizes how to fall... judo has really helped me avoid injury
when falling over the last 10 years.

my 2 cents

Ray

Does the RED impact shorts have tail bone protection?
Does it have hard plastic pieces in addition to foam pads or
is it just foam padding?

thanks

Heather wrote:
www.skeletools.com

Thank you for the tip though I think they all look heavy duty.

Apart from the Torso Tool being designed predominanty for males
(judging from the photos), can I ask who would use something like
that
?

Surely you would have to be doing something rather insane to justify
this ? http://www.skeletools.com/torso.html
Have you used such torso protection before?

Yes... you would not need the torso tool just for regular snowboarding.
It is more for people who are putting themselves into situations were
crashing is common - like boardcross, freestyle, or big-mountain. It
could be useful in other board sports like mountain boarding or
downhill skateboarding (where crashes are often catastrophic). I've
heard of motorcycle racers riding them when they don't want to wear the
full motorcross armour suits.

I'm asking because in addition to the tailbone, my next most frequent
injury is to the shoulder. Every season there's one fall where the
force of the impact goes straight through my arms to the back of my
shoulders or even my neck and it's just sore for the rest of the
trip.
Each subsequent fall is then agony.

Yea, the torso tool isn't going to protect you from that. It will
protect your shoulder, collarbone, spine, and ribs from direct impact -
your shoulder issues are mainly due to you trying use your arms to
"break" your fall... which obviously is a bad idea. Basically you want
to land the the "broadest" part of your body... either your chest or
your back - that will spread the force of the impact over a larger area
and allows it to be dissipated less forcefully.

Heather wrote:
Hi Aegis,

So then another friend taught me to fall onto my forearms when
falling forward. I was also told to fall onto elbow falling backwards
but I get some terribly jarring injuries which shoot up into the back
of my neck that way so I'm willing to try anything new to prevent
that.

I think the person is trying to get you to do a martial arts
break-fall... you basically land on your back first and then follow
with your elbows hit the ground a moment later... this helps dissapate
the impact wave out from the broad area of your back and through your
arms. Look at Figure 5-5 at the bottom of this link
(http://www.self-defense-guide.com/ta...-throwspt1.php).

I suggest that you learn to fall on your back

I can see this working when I'm travelling faster since it is more
of a skid or slide along the surface. However, most of the more
painful incidents actually happen when I fall at slow speed on
relative flats when I'm trying some freestyle ground work.
That is a long way to fall from the vertical.

To reduce the vertical, you need to use your legs to reduce the
downward momentum buy kind of diving at the the snow (I call it
superman-style). A good example is watching basketball players fall
(they have a lot of vertical to fall from)... see how they always push
off with their legs just before their hit and kind of end up sliding
across the ground... you want to do the same thing.

In the end... your main problem is that you are trying to use your
hands to brace and absorb the impact... that is simply not feasible.
You need to learn to absorb the impact primarily with your legs and
torso and get your arms.

wrote:
Does the RED impact shorts have tail bone protection?
Does it have hard plastic pieces in addition to foam pads or
is it just foam padding?

thanks


The RED impact shorts that I've seen, have a tiny bit of tail bone
protection - a bunch of like 1-2cm cubes of foam set in a diamond
pattern - no hard plastic or even a full piece of foam.

Haha! Sorry that I wasn't more clear. With the "rolling" I am referring
to a single forward roll, ending in an outstretched, laying down
position, not multiple rolls. This isn't always possible, though and in
those cases it is best to fall on your forearms, palms down, with your
face sightly to the side (prevents you from an uncomfortable face
plant).

The pain you get when falling on the elbow can actually be much worse
than when falling to your whole arm. That''s because the connection
between the elbow and shoulder is direct, while with the arm there is
some suspension created by the wrist and arm first. The shoulder joint
rotates around inside what is called the rotator cuff, a cartilidge
filled pivot that is not supposed to have inward force applied to it
(at least not the levels of force generated in a fall). Whoever told
you to fall to the elbow did you a disservice - it just trades a
wrist/forearm injury for another - potentially worse - one.

Concerning falling on your back, there is a trick or two to it. If you
just lock out your legs out and fall backwards, that will NOT be good
for you. If falling downhill (like say you have caught a heel edge
while facing uphill) you will get thrown backwards pretty quick. In
this case, you should do two things - the moment you feel the edge
bite, accept that you probably will fall. Sit down to get your butt
(and hence the rest of you) as low as possible, and LOOK AT YOUR belt
or waist and don't lose sight of it. This will help to keep your head
from smacking back into the snow. Then just roll backwards, starting at
your butt and then rolling like a ball towards the back. keep your arms
completely out of the equation, even point your hands at your knees. At
this point, you finish by lightly hitting your arms into the snow, flat
like you were going to make a snow angel. That will likely finish the
fall. You might have some neck muscle strain if that fall is really
hard, but otherwise you'll be just fine, and completely uninjured.

Sometimes when this happens to me I will even back roll once if the
energy isn't dissapaited completely.

As far back falling (towards the summit on your heel edge) this is even
easier. Just follow the same directions above, but in this case it will
be even easier because the angle is under 90 degrees instead of
greater.

In all falling, we are told from when we are little that falling is
bad, to be avoided at all costs. The reason for this commonly isn't
because we are afraid of injury but are afraid of looking foolish. Once
you let go of this attitude, you will be much less likely to be injured
in a fall.

In every video it seems, there is some cool shot of somebody "falling"
but then rolling once or something and riding away. These are guys and
girls that have learned to master their falls so they can ride again
rather than crashing randomly.

Practicing falling on a gym mat is the way to go. in addition to
building good habits, it is a great workout as well. Aikido will
probably be easier for you to take up, because the art can't be
practiced at all without learning to fall. Usually it's the first thing
a new student will learn, and even advanced students practice it every
day. It will do more to protect you in everday life than almost any
other skill. Also, aikido in general is not a competition, so the only
opponent is really yourself; your partner is there to help you learn,
not to beat you. I have taken 3 years of judo, 3 of aikido and can say
that I prefer the latter, although both are wonderful arts.
Good luck, and I hope all your falls are controlled ones!!!!!!!

On the reds - mine are ancient, and this season I will be getting new
ones, probably the Crash-Pads. The new reds look good too, though.
Plus, they offer a womens' specific fit.

Here are some links to companies that sell impact shorts:
http://freefallgear.com/products.html
http://www.crash-pads.com
http://www.burton.com/red/

and a decent overview of all the armor options open to you:
http://www.abc-of-snowboarding.com/protective-gear.asp