For inspiration: a true viking breaks a record

I remember a story of a U.S. park ranger in California climbing up the Mt
Shasta volcano (over 4000 meters altitude) 6 times in 24 hours, and _skiing_
down each time. I think that's over 10000 vertical meters total, and it's
way steeper than 12 degrees.

But the greatest achievement I've heard of is skiing from the summit of Mont
Blanc (France/Italy) to the summit of Monte Rosa (Switzerland/Italy) in 36
hours. I seem to remember the guy was a mountain guide from Martigny,
Switzerland. It requires not just elite athletic capacity, but great
technical skill, navigation -- and it's just a way more beautiful concept
than climbing the same hill 19 times or 6 times.

Ken

These are great stories!

I would also like to promote the winner of the US Birkie 2003 classic,
Egil Nilsen. He and friends set the record of crossing Greenland by
skis: nine days. But it was later broken by three other guys.
http://www.softgels.co.uk/src/en/en_news.htm
http://www.sologregn.no/index.jsp?section=2&item=230284

The first artice is now translated:
http://www.fasterskier.com/feature.php?id=432
"It’s not a race, it’s not for money, not to please
sponsors"

Yes, crossing Greenland sounds like a fine adventure.

Here's another: Traversing the Sierra mountain range in California from Mt
Whitney to Yosemite valley with skis. I've heard that the record is 7 days.
I'll bet that record could be lowered, and I'll bet that the terrain is a
lot more interesting than Greenland.

There's also some interesting shorter high-traverse adventures in the
Sierras -- which have informal records: I've heard things like skating from
North Lake to Rock Creek in 12 hours, or Rock Creek to Mammoth in 8 hours.
Both trips stay above 3000 meters almost the whole way, and require crossing
some interestingly steep high passes. Normally they are done as multi-day
trips on heavy mountaineering skis, but a few people try them on light gear.

Ken

(Lars) wrote in message . com...

In 23 hours running up and down a mountain 19 times, total length of
three marathons and a altitude climbing of 7000meters. Average angle
of 12 degrees.

12 *percent*, I think - as in 12/100 and not 12/90:-)

It would appear it was roughly 3000m and an altitude gain
of 400m - for each of those 18 ascents, with the same
amount of altitude loss on those descents:-) - making a
grand total of 114km and about 7500m.


Interestingly, Hjelmeset started at 1000 hours, did 10 tours
to the top nonstop, took a break and did a further 6 before
bivouacking in a cabin on the top at 2400 hours, making it
16 tours in 13 hours. When he resumed at 6000 hours, it took
him 3h50m to complete 3 tours; the previous day had certainly
taking its toll!


Perhaps not unsurprising for anyone who has dabbled in hill
running, it was the downhills that turned out to be the
worst part towards the end.


Anders

Ken,
When some friends and I did it, it was Rock Creek to North Lake in 13
hours. But we weren't trying for any time records - just trying to
survive it in a day. When skating in the high country, anytime you're
out anytime in the afternoon it ends up being a long slog. We started
at 4 am, but by noon it got pretty mushy and slow. We haven't done the
Rock Creek/Mammoth section (yet), but Twin Lakes (Bridgeport) to
Mammoth Lakes has been done in 2 sections on skate gear more than a
few times.

Mark

"Ken Roberts" wrote in message ...
Yes, crossing Greenland sounds like a fine adventure.

Here's another: Traversing the Sierra mountain range in California from Mt
Whitney to Yosemite valley with skis. I've heard that the record is 7 days.
I'll bet that record could be lowered, and I'll bet that the terrain is a
lot more interesting than Greenland.

There's also some interesting shorter high-traverse adventures in the
Sierras -- which have informal records: I've heard things like skating from
North Lake to Rock Creek in 12 hours, or Rock Creek to Mammoth in 8 hours.
Both trips stay above 3000 meters almost the whole way, and require crossing
some interestingly steep high passes. Normally they are done as multi-day
trips on heavy mountaineering skis, but a few people try them on light gear.

Ken

(Mark) wrote in message . com...
Ken,
When some friends and I did it, it was Rock Creek to North Lake in 13
hours. But we weren't trying for any time records - just trying to
survive it in a day. When skating in the high country, anytime you're
out anytime in the afternoon it ends up being a long slog. We started
at 4 am, but by noon it got pretty mushy and slow. We haven't done the
Rock Creek/Mammoth section (yet), but Twin Lakes (Bridgeport) to
Mammoth Lakes has been done in 2 sections on skate gear more than a
few times.

Not having a steady job sure has its benefits sometimes....

bt

For you that may be just "survival", Mark, but I know that's amazing for any
"normally" athletic skier.
Rock Creek to North Lake in 13 hours.

I think I even saw published in a magazine less than five years ago that the
"record" for that tour was 17 hours.

Did you go by way of Lake Italy? That was where Dave from Tahoe introduced
me to backcountry skating (but not in a single day).

For a single-day, I had envisioned doing it South-to-North -- but now that I
think about your trip, Yes, North-to-South makes more sense to me. Because
that way I can take the steepest slopes as uphill climbs.

Twin Lakes (Bridgeport) to Mammoth Lakes
has been done in 2 sections on skate gear more than a few times.

I've done that as two separate day trips, in separate years. I did them in
the opposite direction, but again I bet your way makes more sense. And
linking them up also makes sense, since getting up or down Lee Vining canyon
in the middle can be a big pain. Both times I stayed a night at Tioga Pass
Resort anyway -- at the junction of those two sections. Next time I think
I'd book two or three nights there, to allow for a rest day, or to wait for
best conditions.

When I went from Mammoth to Tioga this April, I took the most direct route:
over Deadman summit, then a long sidehill on the west side of the San
Joaquin ridge, then a little west of Gem Lake and by Koip Peak to Parker
Pass and Dana Meadows. I did it Classic style on heavier gear, because I
had never done the route before -- so it was a _long_ day, starting about 3
am. I was wishing for skating skis for everything north of Parker Pass.

But that long sidehill on the San Joaquin ridge -- not sure I'd want to
skate that. Did you stay lower to avoid that -- then climb up the Agnew
Meadows road to Mammoth?

We haven't done the Rock Creek/Mammoth section (yet)

I haven't done it as a day-trip yet, but when I did it as an overnight, I
actually met Marty Hornick on the route just south of Duck Pass. Marty was
the first (only?) skier to do it under 8 hours. I remember he told me the
first time it took him 14 hours, and it was his fourth time when he got it
down under 8. Then he told me that without my overnight pack, he thought I
could do it in one day -- and that's what got me started on big single-day
traverses in the Sierras.

Ken

Ken,

Our "style" of backcountry skating has definitely evolved over the
last 10 years, from starting out on older Fischer RCS skis to now
using only Revolutions (or sometimes Fischer Adventures for the really
steep and icy tours). The first highcountry tour we took was an
aborted adventure in 1993 from Twin Lakes (Bridgeport) to Mammoth. We
were planning on taking 2 days to get to Mammoth, with an overnight
stay in the Tuolemne Meadows. We got somewhat "off-track", ended up in
Glen Aulin, ran out of snow in Lyell Canyon the next day, and aborted
out over Tioga Pass. I had done that section as a one-day tour on old
Fischer Tour skis in the early 80's, so getting lost was a bit
embarrassing. The next time we did it, we made sure to stay high and
made to the Meadows easily in 9 hours, and then continued on to
Mammoth the next day. After 1000 Island Lake, we stayed "medium-high"
on San Joaquin, basically following the PCT. The side hill was a bit
annoying, but a lot better than trying to bushwhack through the trees
at the bottom of the canyon that late in the day. We eventually
descended into Agnew Meadows and then climbed up to Minaret Summit.
Those last two hours were pretty much a death-slog up a heavily
snowmobiled and very dirty road.

Our first successful Rock Creek/North Lake tour was also our second
try. We originally tried to do it in two days, starting at North Lake
and ending at Rock Creek. We got to French Canyon, camped, woke up in
the middle of the night to find that it didn't freeze over due to
cloud cover, and aborted out to Pine Creek. Some of the hairiest
skiing I've ever done - not recommended for skating gear! I think that
was our last "overnighter" on skating gear. We discovered that it was
just more FUN to leave the sleeping bag and bivy gear behind and just
"go for it" in a single day. We also realized that, in the high
country on skating gear, it is generally better to climb the steep
stuff on the north side, so you have a little softer corn for the
descent on the south facing slopes. That's why the next time we tried
it was north to south. We started at Rock Creek Lake, then climbed
over the north shoulder of Bear Creek Spire and descended almost to
Lake Italy, then curled around back over Italy Pass, descended that
and climbed up to Royce Lakes and then into Humphrey's Basin. It was a
great tour, just a little long by the end of it. Like I said before,
it's no fun trying to skate through 2 feet of mush at 2 in the
afternoon.

Mark

"Ken Roberts" wrote in message ...
For you that may be just "survival", Mark, but I know that's amazing for any
"normally" athletic skier.
Rock Creek to North Lake in 13 hours.

I think I even saw published in a magazine less than five years ago that the
"record" for that tour was 17 hours.

Did you go by way of Lake Italy? That was where Dave from Tahoe introduced
me to backcountry skating (but not in a single day).

For a single-day, I had envisioned doing it South-to-North -- but now that I
think about your trip, Yes, North-to-South makes more sense to me. Because
that way I can take the steepest slopes as uphill climbs.

Twin Lakes (Bridgeport) to Mammoth Lakes
has been done in 2 sections on skate gear more than a few times.

I've done that as two separate day trips, in separate years. I did them in
the opposite direction, but again I bet your way makes more sense. And
linking them up also makes sense, since getting up or down Lee Vining canyon
in the middle can be a big pain. Both times I stayed a night at Tioga Pass
Resort anyway -- at the junction of those two sections. Next time I think
I'd book two or three nights there, to allow for a rest day, or to wait for
best conditions.

When I went from Mammoth to Tioga this April, I took the most direct route:
over Deadman summit, then a long sidehill on the west side of the San
Joaquin ridge, then a little west of Gem Lake and by Koip Peak to Parker
Pass and Dana Meadows. I did it Classic style on heavier gear, because I
had never done the route before -- so it was a _long_ day, starting about 3
am. I was wishing for skating skis for everything north of Parker Pass.

But that long sidehill on the San Joaquin ridge -- not sure I'd want to
skate that. Did you stay lower to avoid that -- then climb up the Agnew
Meadows road to Mammoth?

We haven't done the Rock Creek/Mammoth section (yet)

I haven't done it as a day-trip yet, but when I did it as an overnight, I
actually met Marty Hornick on the route just south of Duck Pass. Marty was
the first (only?) skier to do it under 8 hours. I remember he told me the
first time it took him 14 hours, and it was his fourth time when he got it
down under 8. Then he told me that without my overnight pack, he thought I
could do it in one day -- and that's what got me started on big single-day
traverses in the Sierras.

Ken

Thanks for all the ideas, Mark.

now using only Revolutions (or sometimes
Fischer Adventures for the really steep and icy tours).

I can't find the Revolutions on the Fischer website any more. I never owned
a pair, and it seems that Fischer also used the "Revolution" label for some
of its alpine skis. So let me make sure I understand what you're using:
-- short ski
-- metal edge (?)
-- waxable base for skating (?) (even though it also came in no-wax
versions)

I wonder if my Madshus Pellestova skis are close enough to the Revolutions,
of if I should consider getting something more specific for Sierra high
tours. The Pellestovas are 178 cm, pair-weight around 2 kg, full metal
edge, waxable base, enough sidecut for better downhill turning than I would
have guessed -- and I use them with my Salomon Combi Race boots.

We discovered that it was just more FUN to
leave the sleeping bag and bivy gear behind and just
"go for it" in a single day.

Yes, carrying a heavy pack has taken me to some great places, but "fun"
doesn't usually come to mind until I take it off. And "going for it" on a
point-to-point backcountry traverse in a single day adds a dimension of
seriousness and commitment that I don't find in racing. Much of my race
training looks beyond to April and May, preparing to be fast enough when the
"right" day comes there on the Sierra Eastside. (But I do try to bring
enough clothing with me so I feel like I'd have a good chance of surviving
if I were still out after the sun goes down.)

We also realized that, in the high country on
skating gear, it is generally better to climb the
steep stuff on the north side

Now I'm learning to apply that to some of my planning. But when I did Rock
Creek to Mammoth in two days, I came away convinced that South-to-North was
clearly the way to go for that one section of the Sierra Crest. Because
most of the steep slopes are on the south side. So I found I could just
take my skis off and boot up those, then get a long cruise down the
less-steep slopes on the other side. And something Marty Hornick told me
made me think pretty definitely that he did his under-8-hour achievement in
the South-to-North direction, and was happy with that plan.

. . . Humphrey's Basin . . . Like I said before,
it's no fun trying to skate through 2 feet of mush
at 2 in the afternoon.

My experience skating across Humpheys Basin in April a couple of years ago
was completely different. It had been hot and mushy the day _before_, while
I was preparing. Then it froze real hard, and like crossing Desolation
Lake -- never mind skating, even with metal edges -- I could barely get my
pole tips to dig in.


"Mark" wrote in message
om...
Ken,

Our "style" of backcountry skating has definitely evolved over the
last 10 years, from starting out on older Fischer RCS skis to now
using only Revolutions (or sometimes Fischer Adventures for the really
steep and icy tours). The first highcountry tour we took was an
aborted adventure in 1993 from Twin Lakes (Bridgeport) to Mammoth. We
were planning on taking 2 days to get to Mammoth, with an overnight
stay in the Tuolemne Meadows. We got somewhat "off-track", ended up in
Glen Aulin, ran out of snow in Lyell Canyon the next day, and aborted
out over Tioga Pass. I had done that section as a one-day tour on old
Fischer Tour skis in the early 80's, so getting lost was a bit
embarrassing. The next time we did it, we made sure to stay high and
made to the Meadows easily in 9 hours, and then continued on to
Mammoth the next day. After 1000 Island Lake, we stayed "medium-high"
on San Joaquin, basically following the PCT. The side hill was a bit
annoying, but a lot better than trying to bushwhack through the trees
at the bottom of the canyon that late in the day. We eventually
descended into Agnew Meadows and then climbed up to Minaret Summit.
Those last two hours were pretty much a death-slog up a heavily
snowmobiled and very dirty road.

Our first successful Rock Creek/North Lake tour was also our second
try. We originally tried to do it in two days, starting at North Lake
and ending at Rock Creek. We got to French Canyon, camped, woke up in
the middle of the night to find that it didn't freeze over due to
cloud cover, and aborted out to Pine Creek. Some of the hairiest
skiing I've ever done - not recommended for skating gear! I think that
was our last "overnighter" on skating gear. We discovered that it was
just more FUN to leave the sleeping bag and bivy gear behind and just
"go for it" in a single day. We also realized that, in the high
country on skating gear, it is generally better to climb the steep
stuff on the north side, so you have a little softer corn for the
descent on the south facing slopes. That's why the next time we tried
it was north to south. We started at Rock Creek Lake, then climbed
over the north shoulder of Bear Creek Spire and descended almost to
Lake Italy, then curled around back over Italy Pass, descended that
and climbed up to Royce Lakes and then into Humphrey's Basin. It was a
great tour, just a little long by the end of it. Like I said before,
it's no fun trying to skate through 2 feet of mush at 2 in the
afternoon.

Mark

"Ken Roberts" wrote in message
...
For you that may be just "survival", Mark, but I know that's amazing for
any
"normally" athletic skier.
Rock Creek to North Lake in 13 hours.

I think I even saw published in a magazine less than five years ago that
the
"record" for that tour was 17 hours.

Did you go by way of Lake Italy? That was where Dave from Tahoe
introduced
me to backcountry skating (but not in a single day).

For a single-day, I had envisioned doing it South-to-North -- but now
that I
think about your trip, Yes, North-to-South makes more sense to me.
Because
that way I can take the steepest slopes as uphill climbs.

Twin Lakes (Bridgeport) to Mammoth Lakes
has been done in 2 sections on skate gear more than a few times.

I've done that as two separate day trips, in separate years. I did them
in
the opposite direction, but again I bet your way makes more sense. And
linking them up also makes sense, since getting up or down Lee Vining
canyon
in the middle can be a big pain. Both times I stayed a night at Tioga
Pass
Resort anyway -- at the junction of those two sections. Next time I
think
I'd book two or three nights there, to allow for a rest day, or to wait
for
best conditions.

When I went from Mammoth to Tioga this April, I took the most direct
route:
over Deadman summit, then a long sidehill on the west side of the San
Joaquin ridge, then a little west of Gem Lake and by Koip Peak to Parker
Pass and Dana Meadows. I did it Classic style on heavier gear, because
I
had never done the route before -- so it was a _long_ day, starting
about 3
am. I was wishing for skating skis for everything north of Parker Pass.

But that long sidehill on the San Joaquin ridge -- not sure I'd want to
skate that. Did you stay lower to avoid that -- then climb up the Agnew
Meadows road to Mammoth?

We haven't done the Rock Creek/Mammoth section (yet)

I haven't done it as a day-trip yet, but when I did it as an overnight,
I
actually met Marty Hornick on the route just south of Duck Pass. Marty
was
the first (only?) skier to do it under 8 hours. I remember he told me
the
first time it took him 14 hours, and it was his fourth time when he got
it
down under 8. Then he told me that without my overnight pack, he
thought I
could do it in one day -- and that's what got me started on big
single-day
traverses in the Sierras.

Ken

Fischer came out with their "Nordic Cruiser" line last season and there
are a few models that would probably be perfect for this. They're shorter
and way more stable than racing skis, but still super light and have a great
feel for them. They're a blast to ski.

I should probably know this, but I *think* they have a skating model
with metal edges, which would probably be ideal for the high-speed
backcountry excursions. I'm not sure if the pair I tried out were going to
production this year or next.

-Nathan
http://nsavage.com

"Ken Roberts" wrote in message
news
Thanks for all the ideas, Mark.

now using only Revolutions (or sometimes
Fischer Adventures for the really steep and icy tours).

I can't find the Revolutions on the Fischer website any more. I never
owned
a pair, and it seems that Fischer also used the "Revolution" label for
some
of its alpine skis. So let me make sure I understand what you're using:
-- short ski
-- metal edge (?)
-- waxable base for skating (?) (even though it also came in no-wax
versions)

I wonder if my Madshus Pellestova skis are close enough to the
Revolutions,
of if I should consider getting something more specific for Sierra high
tours. The Pellestovas are 178 cm, pair-weight around 2 kg, full metal
edge, waxable base, enough sidecut for better downhill turning than I
would
have guessed -- and I use them with my Salomon Combi Race boots.

We discovered that it was just more FUN to
leave the sleeping bag and bivy gear behind and just
"go for it" in a single day.

Yes, carrying a heavy pack has taken me to some great places, but "fun"
doesn't usually come to mind until I take it off. And "going for it" on a
point-to-point backcountry traverse in a single day adds a dimension of
seriousness and commitment that I don't find in racing. Much of my race
training looks beyond to April and May, preparing to be fast enough when
the
"right" day comes there on the Sierra Eastside. (But I do try to bring
enough clothing with me so I feel like I'd have a good chance of surviving
if I were still out after the sun goes down.)

We also realized that, in the high country on
skating gear, it is generally better to climb the
steep stuff on the north side

Now I'm learning to apply that to some of my planning. But when I did
Rock
Creek to Mammoth in two days, I came away convinced that South-to-North
was
clearly the way to go for that one section of the Sierra Crest. Because
most of the steep slopes are on the south side. So I found I could just
take my skis off and boot up those, then get a long cruise down the
less-steep slopes on the other side. And something Marty Hornick told me
made me think pretty definitely that he did his under-8-hour achievement
in
the South-to-North direction, and was happy with that plan.

. . . Humphrey's Basin . . . Like I said before,
it's no fun trying to skate through 2 feet of mush
at 2 in the afternoon.

My experience skating across Humpheys Basin in April a couple of years ago
was completely different. It had been hot and mushy the day _before_,
while
I was preparing. Then it froze real hard, and like crossing Desolation
Lake -- never mind skating, even with metal edges -- I could barely get my
pole tips to dig in.


"Mark" wrote in message
om...
Ken,

Our "style" of backcountry skating has definitely evolved over the
last 10 years, from starting out on older Fischer RCS skis to now
using only Revolutions (or sometimes Fischer Adventures for the really
steep and icy tours). The first highcountry tour we took was an
aborted adventure in 1993 from Twin Lakes (Bridgeport) to Mammoth. We
were planning on taking 2 days to get to Mammoth, with an overnight
stay in the Tuolemne Meadows. We got somewhat "off-track", ended up in
Glen Aulin, ran out of snow in Lyell Canyon the next day, and aborted
out over Tioga Pass. I had done that section as a one-day tour on old
Fischer Tour skis in the early 80's, so getting lost was a bit
embarrassing. The next time we did it, we made sure to stay high and
made to the Meadows easily in 9 hours, and then continued on to
Mammoth the next day. After 1000 Island Lake, we stayed "medium-high"
on San Joaquin, basically following the PCT. The side hill was a bit
annoying, but a lot better than trying to bushwhack through the trees
at the bottom of the canyon that late in the day. We eventually
descended into Agnew Meadows and then climbed up to Minaret Summit.
Those last two hours were pretty much a death-slog up a heavily
snowmobiled and very dirty road.

Our first successful Rock Creek/North Lake tour was also our second
try. We originally tried to do it in two days, starting at North Lake
and ending at Rock Creek. We got to French Canyon, camped, woke up in
the middle of the night to find that it didn't freeze over due to
cloud cover, and aborted out to Pine Creek. Some of the hairiest
skiing I've ever done - not recommended for skating gear! I think that
was our last "overnighter" on skating gear. We discovered that it was
just more FUN to leave the sleeping bag and bivy gear behind and just
"go for it" in a single day. We also realized that, in the high
country on skating gear, it is generally better to climb the steep
stuff on the north side, so you have a little softer corn for the
descent on the south facing slopes. That's why the next time we tried
it was north to south. We started at Rock Creek Lake, then climbed
over the north shoulder of Bear Creek Spire and descended almost to
Lake Italy, then curled around back over Italy Pass, descended that
and climbed up to Royce Lakes and then into Humphrey's Basin. It was a
great tour, just a little long by the end of it. Like I said before,
it's no fun trying to skate through 2 feet of mush at 2 in the
afternoon.

Mark

"Ken Roberts" wrote in message
...
For you that may be just "survival", Mark, but I know that's amazing
for
any
"normally" athletic skier.
Rock Creek to North Lake in 13 hours.

I think I even saw published in a magazine less than five years ago
that
the
"record" for that tour was 17 hours.

Did you go by way of Lake Italy? That was where Dave from Tahoe
introduced
me to backcountry skating (but not in a single day).

For a single-day, I had envisioned doing it South-to-North -- but now
that I
think about your trip, Yes, North-to-South makes more sense to me.
Because
that way I can take the steepest slopes as uphill climbs.

Twin Lakes (Bridgeport) to Mammoth Lakes
has been done in 2 sections on skate gear more than a few times.

I've done that as two separate day trips, in separate years. I did
them
in
the opposite direction, but again I bet your way makes more sense.
And
linking them up also makes sense, since getting up or down Lee Vining
canyon
in the middle can be a big pain. Both times I stayed a night at Tioga
Pass
Resort anyway -- at the junction of those two sections. Next time I
think
I'd book two or three nights there, to allow for a rest day, or to
wait
for
best conditions.

When I went from Mammoth to Tioga this April, I took the most direct
route:
over Deadman summit, then a long sidehill on the west side of the San
Joaquin ridge, then a little west of Gem Lake and by Koip Peak to
Parker
Pass and Dana Meadows. I did it Classic style on heavier gear,
because
I
had never done the route before -- so it was a _long_ day, starting
about 3
am. I was wishing for skating skis for everything north of Parker
Pass.

But that long sidehill on the San Joaquin ridge -- not sure I'd want
to
skate that. Did you stay lower to avoid that -- then climb up the
Agnew
Meadows road to Mammoth?

We haven't done the Rock Creek/Mammoth section (yet)

I haven't done it as a day-trip yet, but when I did it as an
overnight,
I
actually met Marty Hornick on the route just south of Duck Pass.
Marty
was
the first (only?) skier to do it under 8 hours. I remember he told me
the
first time it took him 14 hours, and it was his fourth time when he
got
it
down under 8. Then he told me that without my overnight pack, he
thought I
could do it in one day -- and that's what got me started on big
single-day
traverses in the Sierras.

Ken