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Controlling Speed Down the Fall Line



 
 
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  #21  
Old January 16th 04, 05:17 PM
Armin
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(John Red-Horse) wrote in message ...
In article ,
wrote:

I didn't know you had some real 225 DH skis to suppliment your leetle
cable rig. Good for you.


Chicks dig skin-tight plastified body suits...

cheers,
john


I assume you're speaking from personal experience? Must have been an,
errrr, "interesting" week at Fairy Meadows hut last year. You pinnas
are all the same... twisted! ;-)

Armin

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  #24  
Old January 17th 04, 01:54 AM
Kneale Brownson
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"Jon Bond" wrote in message ...
"Kneale Brownson" wrote in message
om...
John Smith wrote in message

om...
I'm an intermediate skier. I need more lessons. These things I know
are true. And one other truth I know is that I frequently feel out of
control when I try to ski the fall line. When I ski the fall line I
feel like I'm just going faster and faster and beyond my comfort zone.
As I approach that discomfort zone, I stop or I begin wide slow
traverses of the run.

I'm not so worried about speed as I am about control; I can't afford
time off from work due to injuries.

What's involved, technically, in maintaining a controlled speed when
skiing the fall line (I'm tired of imitating the ball rolling down the
hill at the mercy of gravity)?

JS



The "secret" is to not get going too fast in the first place. The
technique is to let each turn continue (even back up the hill if
necessary) until you've reached a comfortable speed. Realize that the
beginning of each turn is going to make your skis accelerate because
they point downhill to start the turn. Then let that turn continue
until your pace is comfortable. If you try to make several turns that
end with the skis still pointing somewhat downhill, you will be
gaining speed with each turn. Finally, you will have to really
"brake" to get your speed back into the comfort zone. The most
effective way to turn as I've described is to think about turning the
right ski to the right when you want to go that direction and the left
ski to the left for that direction. If you think in terms of turning
right by pushing out the left ski, you end up skidding the tail of
that ski and cannot turn sufficiently uphill to really get slowing out
of the turns.

Find an instructor who will talk about turning the right ski to turn
right and the left to turn left and then sign up for a lesson.



Um, very few if any instructors will tell you that. With straight skis,
maybe - but even then, its still pretty bad technique. You don't ski one
ski at a time - you ski with a harmony between the two (unless, of course,
you're doing one ski drills... but I digress). You want to steer the
inside ski some, but thats far different than turning the inside ski.
Thinking about turning just the inside ski is asking for that awkward
toes-out stance that automatically throws your weight back, and thats a much
bigger problem to deal with. There is a steering component, but
oversimplifying it by saying "turn the inside ski" is a huge mistake. ANY
competent instructor will be able to help you with speed control - its one
of those basic things you need to teach, so you figure out how to best do it
REAL quickly.

As for never getting too fast, thats ok - but when you understand how to
control your speed, you understand how to slow down to your comfort speed by
changing your turn shape, which is an imperitive skill. For practice, you
don't want to let yourself get too fast, but never going out of your comfort
zone will not promote further learning.

Jon Bond
PSIA Level 1 Alpine


Undersimplifying things just gets too confusing in many cases, Jon. A
focus on the inside ski gets away from the outside ski push that keeps
most intermediate skiers in the terminal mode. Try this the next time
you're out sliding: On a shallow hill, from a straight run, roll up
the arch of your right foot. This means, you're starting with equally
weighted skis and you're just lifting the right arch off the snow, not
the right ski. If you're on any kind of shaped ski, you'll turn
right. Rolling up the arch generally makes you automatically apply
additional weight to the opposite ski, and edging the inside ski makes
you move your center of mass sufficiently to "accidentally" edge the
opposite ski. Ergo, a turn. Pushing out the outside ski to turn is a
defensive move. Steering/edging the inside ski to turn is an
offensive move. While exploring outside the comfort zone adds to your
experience and can increase confidence, you can't learn new things
properly where you're not relaxed. That's one of the first things I
learned when I began teaching skiing long enough ago to now wear a
gold PSIA 30-years pin.

  #25  
Old January 17th 04, 06:05 AM
Jon Bond
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"Kneale Brownson" wrote in message
om...
"Jon Bond" wrote in message

...
"Kneale Brownson" wrote in message
om...
John Smith wrote in message

om...
I'm an intermediate skier. I need more lessons. These things I

know
are true. And one other truth I know is that I frequently feel out

of
control when I try to ski the fall line. When I ski the fall line I
feel like I'm just going faster and faster and beyond my comfort

zone.
As I approach that discomfort zone, I stop or I begin wide slow
traverses of the run.

I'm not so worried about speed as I am about control; I can't afford
time off from work due to injuries.

What's involved, technically, in maintaining a controlled speed when
skiing the fall line (I'm tired of imitating the ball rolling down

the
hill at the mercy of gravity)?

JS


The "secret" is to not get going too fast in the first place. The
technique is to let each turn continue (even back up the hill if
necessary) until you've reached a comfortable speed. Realize that the
beginning of each turn is going to make your skis accelerate because
they point downhill to start the turn. Then let that turn continue
until your pace is comfortable. If you try to make several turns that
end with the skis still pointing somewhat downhill, you will be
gaining speed with each turn. Finally, you will have to really
"brake" to get your speed back into the comfort zone. The most
effective way to turn as I've described is to think about turning the
right ski to the right when you want to go that direction and the left
ski to the left for that direction. If you think in terms of turning
right by pushing out the left ski, you end up skidding the tail of
that ski and cannot turn sufficiently uphill to really get slowing out
of the turns.

Find an instructor who will talk about turning the right ski to turn
right and the left to turn left and then sign up for a lesson.



Um, very few if any instructors will tell you that. With straight skis,
maybe - but even then, its still pretty bad technique. You don't ski

one
ski at a time - you ski with a harmony between the two (unless, of

course,
you're doing one ski drills... but I digress). You want to steer the
inside ski some, but thats far different than turning the inside ski.
Thinking about turning just the inside ski is asking for that awkward
toes-out stance that automatically throws your weight back, and thats a

much
bigger problem to deal with. There is a steering component, but
oversimplifying it by saying "turn the inside ski" is a huge mistake.

ANY
competent instructor will be able to help you with speed control - its

one
of those basic things you need to teach, so you figure out how to best

do it
REAL quickly.

As for never getting too fast, thats ok - but when you understand how to
control your speed, you understand how to slow down to your comfort

speed by
changing your turn shape, which is an imperitive skill. For practice,

you
don't want to let yourself get too fast, but never going out of your

comfort
zone will not promote further learning.

Jon Bond
PSIA Level 1 Alpine


Undersimplifying things just gets too confusing in many cases, Jon. A
focus on the inside ski gets away from the outside ski push that keeps
most intermediate skiers in the terminal mode. Try this the next time
you're out sliding: On a shallow hill, from a straight run, roll up
the arch of your right foot. This means, you're starting with equally
weighted skis and you're just lifting the right arch off the snow, not
the right ski. If you're on any kind of shaped ski, you'll turn
right. Rolling up the arch generally makes you automatically apply
additional weight to the opposite ski, and edging the inside ski makes
you move your center of mass sufficiently to "accidentally" edge the
opposite ski. Ergo, a turn. Pushing out the outside ski to turn is a
defensive move. Steering/edging the inside ski to turn is an
offensive move. While exploring outside the comfort zone adds to your
experience and can increase confidence, you can't learn new things
properly where you're not relaxed. That's one of the first things I
learned when I began teaching skiing long enough ago to now wear a
gold PSIA 30-years pin.


Different strokes for different folks I guess!

The way you describe it now I get what you're trying to say - I thought you
were talking about ROTATING the inside ski towards where you want to turn,
not tilting. I've actually tried that one in a clinic - it didn't do
anything for me, but it did help a couple people. I didn't like how it
ended up with me (and a lot of people) instinctively taking a LOT of weight
off that ski - it ended up in a less agressive, messier turn for me. Again
though, thats just me!

My favorite "carve" exercise is the railroad tracks one - 'cause its so
incredibly simple. Semi-flat run (enough so you reach a comfortable
cruising speed straight lining it, but no faster than you're comfortable
with - think green), and then think of just tipping both skis the same
amount one direction. Just a tiny, tiny, tiny little bit. Then back the
other way... and so on. Again, it doesn't work for everyone, but I've
gotten more "Ah ha!" moments with that drill than any other.

Sorry I misunderstood!

And as for the comfort zone - yes you have to learn in a relaxed atmosphere,
but a lot of people (my parents included) get STUCK there. Something about
the way the OP wrote made me think they were in the same category.

Jon Bond



  #27  
Old January 20th 04, 06:08 PM
Armin
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lal_truckee wrote in message ...
Armin wrote:

Hey, what you Pinnas do in the privacy of a remote Canadian mountain
hut is nobodies business! After all, we're pretty open-minded liberals
here in Canada... as witnessed by our stance on same sex marriages and
all.


Are you approving of that Satanist plot to undermine the public
morality! Public mixing of ATers and Pinnas? Where will it all end?! Is
there nothing too dispicable that the evil-doers won't add it to their
agenda?


I don't know about the other AT'ers but I draw the line at sharing my
beer. However, if a Pinna wants to buy me a beer, I'm open-minded
enough to drink it.

The Lord shall bring down fire and brimstone and deep powder and
extended winter on the coupling of ATers and Pinnas, yea speaketh the
Lord thy gawd (and his mate Skadi.)


As long as the fire and brimstone are accompanied by deep powder and
extended winters I think I can make do.

Armin

  #28  
Old January 20th 04, 06:34 PM
John Red-Horse
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Default

In article ,
wrote:

However, if a Pinna wants to buy me a beer, I'm open-minded
enough to drink it.


He's not kidding; I've seen him do it!

cheers,
john

  #30  
Old January 20th 04, 09:47 PM
Walt
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klaus wrote:

Ahh, but there's the difference between AT/Pinna. The Pinna would
drink the beer if he found it open, under a bridge, and warm. Pinnas
are just like that. Well unless it's Kurs or Kokanee.


Even in the winter?

I don't know about you, but if I found an open beer bottle in the snow
with warm yellow liquid in it, I don't think I'd drink it. Chance are
it'd taste just like Coors.

--
//-Walt
//
// http://tinyurl.com/3xqyq

 




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