My trip report (Chair operators = Idiots)

wrote:

Better if you can go midweek. Least crowded day I ever went was midweek
during one of the Santa Ana windstorms that sometimes blow semis off into
the ditch. Wonderful time, nearly empty -- and the winds were only on
the way, not at the resort.

on my last run, when I was riding the lift, the wind started to pick up,
and the lift stopped (someone must have fell somewhere) and I got scared
for a second. lol. I thought, "Ok if the chair starts rocking back and
forth from the wind, should I jump?"

No, for lots of reasons: (1) You hardly ever hear of chairs falling off the
cable, so it doesn't happen very much; (2) Jumping off the chair causes every
other chair to bob up and down, which could cause problems all by itself; (3)
If you do it you could hurt yourself if you land on a rock that you couldn't
see because it was covered with snow or bash your head on the seat or some
other dumb injury that you didn't really need; and (4) you'll probably get
your ticket yanked.

Resort management doesn't want you to die as a result of mechanical
malfunction. It costs them money in addition to the lost revenue -- the dead
don't ski. The ski patrol doesn't want you to die either -- it reflects badly
on their skills.

Longest lift stop I've been on was 45 minutes -- somebody's jacket apparently
got caught in the works. The guy in the chair behind me got tired of his
afraid-of-heights date (feet maybe 6 feet off the ground) whining, said "I'm
going for help" and jumped. No idea what happened to him, but at least the
woman stopped yelling.

Exactly, unless you do one last run when you know you're really too tired
but just want to do one more and halfway down you realize that it was a
big mistake.

Well, I felt fine when we left, my knees were aching a little, but no big
deal. But I went to sleep last night around 9pm, woke up around 12am, went
back to sleep around 2am, slept until 10...went back to sleep from 1pm to
5pm. So I slept about 15 hours to recover from the experience.

Knees feel fine today, but my calves hurt like crazy! I cant even walk
correctly. Not to mention my bright red nose.

Cheer up, it gets better. Pain like that means you might be doing something
wrong. Something to ask the instructor about if you take another lesson.

--
Cheers, Bev
================================================== ===========
"On the other hand, I live in California so I'd be willing to
squeeze schoolchildren to death if I thought some oil would
come out." -- Scott Adams

wrote:

please" and "stop the lift" and "Eiiiiieee!" but not "hold". What
exactly did you expect them to do?

I expect him to Hold it until we (mainly my friend) sit down...then let
the lift go.

OK, what do you do next time? Before you get to a location where the
chair can hit you, ask the lift operator to do whatever you want - after
he's slowed the lift or stopped it or whatever, then you slide forward

Does he slow the lift by grabbing onto it and Holding it so it slows
down?
Thats what I always thought.

They do that on the short single and double chairs around here.

First, don't worry - chairlifts becomes second nature about the third day.

Im ok with it now...not good, but ok...but I still freak a little when
Im high up and the wind blows. (I dont like roller coasters)

Don't look down. You don't need to steer, somebody else is taking care of
that. Admire the trees and the birds and the clouds and study the attachment
mechanism of the chair to the cable, thereby assuring yourself that it's
pretty firmly attached and isn't likely to fall off just for the hell of it.

and Thank you for answering my question about the White Paper.
Yeah, I will probably hold on to it for awhile.

Souvenir. A local place gives you a couple of bucks off your next rental if
you give it to the rental guy.

But like I said, their system just doesnt seem efficent.
So they check the skis and see which ones are missing, but then they
have to go back and search through each paper to see who had those
skis.

Makes more sense if they give you back the paper at the end of the day,
and if there are any papers left, those are the ones who took the skis.

The computer takes care of that here.

--
Cheers, Bev
================================================== ===========
"On the other hand, I live in California so I'd be willing to
squeeze schoolchildren to death if I thought some oil would
come out." -- Scott Adams

The Real Bev wrote:

Resort management doesn't want you to die as a result of mechanical
malfunction. It costs them money in addition to the lost revenue -- the
dead don't ski. The ski patrol doesn't want you to die either -- it
reflects badly on their skills.

Absolutely; they catch anyone dying around here, they take them out back
and beat them to death. Don't want ANYONE reflecting badly on their skills.

wrote in message
oups.com...
please" and "stop the lift" and "Eiiiiieee!" but not "hold". What
exactly did you expect them to do?

I expect him to Hold it until we (mainly my friend) sit down...then let
the lift go.

OK, what do you do next time? Before you get to a location where the
chair can hit you, ask the lift operator to do whatever you want - after
he's slowed the lift or stopped it or whatever, then you slide forward

Does he slow the lift by grabbing onto it and Holding it so it slows
down?
Thats what I always thought.


No. When parents ask for a slow down for their kids the operator will hit a
control which runs the entire lift slower for a moment. Its done all the
time. I wouldn't have had a clue what you meant by "hold the lift" either,
but I can understand why a person new to anything might come up with
terminology which might seem odd to the people doing it. Try to imagine how
long it would take to get to the top if they actually stopped the lift for
every person getting on. Or even every other person. Detachable lifts (most
quads) slow down in the terminal, for non detachable lifts the liftie
usually will give the chair a pull back as it reaches the guest, causing the
chair to move slower than the cable for about half a second. (think about a
pendulum, it kind of works like that.)



First, don't worry - chairlifts becomes second nature about the third
day.

Im ok with it now...not good, but ok...but I still freak a little when
Im high up and the wind blows. (I dont like roller coasters)

and Thank you for answering my question about the White Paper.
Yeah, I will probably hold on to it for awhile.

Its your receipt. Try not to lose any sleep over how they manage their book
keeping, somehow it gets done and surprisingly few mistakes are made. If
they do make a mistake and come after you for the skis, you have the
receipt.

wrote in message
oups.com...
Better if you can go midweek. Least crowded day I ever went was midweek
during one of the Santa Ana windstorms that sometimes blow semis off into
the
ditch. Wonderful time, nearly empty -- and the winds were only on the
way,
not at the resort.

on my last run, when I was riding the lift, the wind started to pick
up, and the lift stopped (someone must have fell somewhere) and I got
scared for a second. lol.
I thought, "Ok if the chair starts rocking back and forth from the
wind, should I jump?"

Um, No. The very worst thing which possibly could happen from the chair
rocking back and forth is you could fall off. And thats really out there, it
just doesn't happen. Honest. So think about this: How much worse would it
really be to fall from this height than to jump from this height?


Well, I felt fine when we left, my knees were aching a little, but no
big deal.
But I went to sleep last night around 9pm, woke up around 12am, went
back to sleep around 2am, slept until 10...went back to sleep from 1pm
to 5pm.
So I slept about 15 hours to recover from the experience.

Knees feel fine today, but my calves hurt like crazy! I cant even walk
correctly.

you've stressed muscles you don't normally use. Do some stretching
exercises, it will go away in a day or 2.



Not to mention my bright red nose.

wrote in message
oups.com...
Ok, my friend and I got to Mountain Creek about 8:30, got our tickets
and rentals.

I'm sorry that you had a bad lift line experience. Maybe you should have
mentioned it as constructive criticism to the manager. Then they could
assess whether policy and protocol were followed or if retraining for lift
operator's was appropriate.

My experience with lift chairs being held has more to do with older lifts
than with the newer lifts that slow down for pick up and drop off. The
chair monitors/lift operators always grab the chair to slow it down a little
when it's a fast moving older lift. And if the rider looks like they're
having trouble or they're very young, they grab the chair to slow it down.
If things go wrong, they hit the stop button until everything and everyone
is ready to go. They do a good job. It's the operator's at the drop-off
points, especially the midway points, that have the most trouble paying
attention and tend to be reactive, after the fact, than proactive. Still, my
experience with lift staff has been all-around positive.

I frequently take the singles line on crowded days when I'm skiing with a
buddy. I'm happy to take the ride without my buddy and meet up at the top.
I'll tell the line monitor 1 or 2, giving them the option of matching 1 with
3 or 2 with 2. To me, it's up to them to know what will make the line move
faster for everyone. The key is that I'm willing to ride the lift as a
single. When I ski with my son and we don't want to split up, we get into
the line for doubles. My experience regarding lines 1 through 5 is that 1
is for ski school/employees (ski patrol), 2 is for singles, 3 for doubles, 4
for triples, and 5 for quadruples; of course, that's just on busy weekends.
On slow weekdays there's just 3 lines: ski school, singles, groups. The ski
school line is frequently more of an entry point at the front of the lift
line than an actual line.

When it comes to rental returns I know exactly what you're talking about.
I've always owned my own boots, but have never owned my own skis, so I rent
regulars, performance, or demo's each time depending on what I want to
accomplish that day. The idea of dropping off my skis and just having
someone initial a piece of paper that they might or might not lose or might
be misprocessed always makes me a little uneasy. Still, I've never had a
mishap after years of returning skis up to 20 times a season.

Customer service will vary from one resort to the next.

"The Real Bev" wrote in message
...
wrote:

I dont think I got a chance to mention how I felt about the overall
experience.

I liked it...it was fun...but crowded.
He was just sitting in the locker area waiting for me.
I couldnt make him wait too long, so I decided to leave.
But, I wanted to ski until they close down...Im one of those who thinks
"If I paid $xxx I might as well get as much use out of it as possible"

Exactly, unless you do one last run when you know you're really too tired
but just want to do one more and halfway down you realize that it was a
big mistake.

Deciding when to not to do one more run is the toughest part of skiing!
C'mon, just once more. You know you want to.

I'm not going to read this whole thread but I want to agree with the people
that 'hold the chair' is not as obvious as you think . It could mean stop ,
it could mean wait , it could mean assist by grabbing the chair and helping
slow it down . Someone also made the point that many lift operators don't
speak English a fluently as you might . I still don't know if you meant you
wanted him to stop it , slow it down or hold the actual chair for you .
Something along the lines of ' HEY , I'm a beginner , can you slow it down
!!! " might be something I would have said . I still remember how scary it
was my 1st time going on the lift , I practically had to hang on for my life
not to fall off and at the top I got dumped off and fell flat on my face as
my friends got a good laugh . I sort of look back now laughing like it was
some sort of ritualistic initiation or right of passage . I admit I do get a
good laugh watching newbies flopping all over the place but I'm a bit of a
sadist . Don't be so defensive , live , learn and move on and admit when
your wrong . Maybe you weren't totally wrong but you should admit that
looking back at it now you could have been clearer and used a better choice
of words . Life is too short , go skiing .
Ron

wrote in message
oups.com...
Ok, my friend and I got to Mountain Creek about 8:30, got our tickets
and rentals.
Got on the learning slope around 9:15, went down the hill twice (its
about 200 feet)

Took the 10am lesson, to be honest, for me, I didnt learn anything from
the lesson, it just gave me a chance to practice what I knew.

Anyway, after the lesson went up on Sugar hill (the lift all the way on
the left) with my friend.
I would go down and to the side about 200 feet then wait and direct
him.
He had trouble making it without falling...its frustrating when people
do not listen to instructions...like he fell and hes on his back and
hes trying to just stand up.
I tell him that its impossible, and he has to use his poles and lean
against them for support, but he keeps trying to just standup while
flat on his back.

Anyway, after going down twice with me stopping every 200 feet to
direct him, he sat out, so I made two runs (VERY CROWDED)

Then he tried it once more with me stopping and directing him, then I
did 2 more runs then we left.

Anyway, I have two gripes with the damn chair lift operator.

1. One time, when the chair came around, I looked at the operator and
said "HOLD the chair" but he didnt do anything, and the chair actually
knocked my friend down and went over his head (luckily my friend was
lying flat on the ground).
What does that idiot think I meant when I told him "HOLD THE CHAIR"

2. Since I went on the lift by myself, I went on the "Singles" line.
But most of the people there were in groups.
A couple of times, I actually asked the guy in front of me "Is this the
Singles Line?" I got the reply yes, and he turns around and talks to
his group of 2-3 on the Singles line.
Isnt the operator supposed to enforce this rule?
One time, there was a group of 3 on this line, and their friends showed
up, so it turned into a group of 7!!
Dude...when people are in groups on the 'Singles' line, kick them off
and make them get on the back of the line.

Question (forgot to ask them) - when I rented the skis I got a copy of
the renter agreement (white paper) when I returned the skis, they wrote
a "Ret" on the paper.
Was I supposed to hand it in to someone?
I called and asked and this exchanged happened:
Me - Do I give the white paper to someone?
MC - No.
Me - How do you know I returned my skis then? (so I wont get charged)
MC - Did it get a R on the white paper?
Me - Yes...but how would YOU know I have the R...I have the paper
MC - We have the other 2 copies
Me - But they wrote the R on MY paper, not your copy
MC - We check every ski at the end of the day
Me - ok, whatever.

But are you telling me they check every ski and then say "Ok Ski 53827
is missing...lets look through EVERY paper to see who rented it"
That doesnt make sense.

It would make more sense for me to show them my White paper, and get my
two copies back... so whoever left a copy at the end of the day, thats
who did not return the skis.

But anyway, was I supposed to give the paper to someone?
Thanks

Pops wrote:
"VtSkier" wrote in message
...

(schnipperoo)

When you feel like bitching about lifties, try to imagine
yourself doing this job day in and day out. Then imagine
yourself doing this job for around $8.50 per hour.

VtSkier

They do get a free lift pass too don't they?

Pops

Um, yes, for their one day off a week. Killington
at least, is always short handed.

So, 48 hours per week = $442/week less taxes, or
about $400 per week. + $70 for a day of skiing,
which incidentally is the day they really need
to do errands, laundry, etc. Would you, could
you live on that? It's no cheaper to live here
in the country than it is to live in an urban
area. On top of that, it's a seasonal job and
there will always be lag times between the winter
and summer seasonal jobs.

It's a wonder that there aren't lots more problems
than there are considering what this deal is
likely to attract for employees.

The Real Bev wrote:
VtSkier wrote:

Oh, and how does one get familiar with a lift without
riding it? So the newby's responsibility is to tell the
liftie that he/she is a newby and would you please slow
the thing down so I can get the feel of it and not have
any immediate accidents.

Now THAT would be difficult for a limited English speaker to comprehend,
especially in the five to ten seconds or so available.

"I've never ridden a lift before and I need help."

And I think "STOP THE CHAIR" would be a better call to the
liftie, as "STOP" is less ambiguous than "HOLD" for one
who may not speak English too well.

I would think that any panicked yell would do. A simple scream ought to
be sufficient to indicate that there's some sort of problem.

If that's what you wanted. See, I'm a little confused
by the ambiguity. See above about newby lift riders.

When you feel like bitching about lifties, try to imagine
yourself doing this job day in and day out. Then imagine
yourself doing this job for around $8.50 per hour.

I'd rather do that than clean toilets, wouldn't you?

Ah, but the toilet washers, AKA "****house queens", only get
$6.50 per hour. That appellation is an awful thing isn't it?
I grew up believing that any work is honorable. I'm just
passing on what other workers at K think about their fellow
low-paid employees. Actually my first contact with this
"job description" was from a woman who has become a long-
time friend.

It seems that when I first met here while working in the
rental shop at K, she introduced herself as Donna, the
****house queen. She had recently escaped the city and a bad
marriage with her kids and took what the area had to offer.

Now she manages the entire cleaning staff for a large condo
complex nearby.