Monique Y. Mudama wrote:
On 2004-12-07, lal_truckee penned:

Monique Y. Mudama wrote:

Anyway, the salesguy made several claims that I'd like to have
confirmed/denied/discussed:

1) He claimed that leather gloves are warmer than other materials due
to being less porous than fabrics, which are woven.

Wrong


Wrong as in, leather isn't the warmest, or wrong as in, his explanation
doesn't make sense? If the former, what *is* the warmest?

Leather IS porous, and breaths, so you have to wax it to waterproof it,
regularly - a forgotten art - noone maintains gear anymore - they
replace it. Warmth is based on design - many materials can be used
equally well. So there's no "leather is best" or "cordura is best"
answer. Study the design, look for layers, look for how the system is
waterproofed, etc. Hands are wet from the outside (melting snow) and
from the inside (sweat.) Being wet doesn't necessarily imply cold - that
depends on the layering and wind protextion of the system. If you sweat
alot you can try porous layers like goretex, but IMO they're not going
to keep up with sweating.
(BTW, I use leather gloves [with some ducttape] exclusively - as much
because I'm a traditionalist as anything.)



2) He claimed that, from year to year, either Marmot or Swany will
have the warmest glove on the market.

Wrong


Who does, or is the brand immaterial, in which case, how do you decide?

Brand is immaterial, construction and design is paramount. Study the layers.



3) He claimed that, in extremely high-quality handwear, a mitten
won't be any warmer than a glove (this is the one I really wonder
about)

Wrong

What, no followup questions?



4) He claimed that this particular glove had been tested and found to
be the warmest (objectively, via temperature) of all the gloves
tested

Immaterial


Why is the internal temp of the glove immaterial to the question of keeping my
hand warm?

Immaterial because you don't know the test conditions nor the subject
gloves - could be two pairs in summer. This kind of statement is
gobbledy-gook for the unwary.



5) He claimed that the fleece liner will wick away my sweat and keep
my hands from being wet.

Possible


Okay, then, what *will* keep my hands from being wet? Every glove I've ever
had has been soggy after an hour or two, and it's *not* because my hands are
too warm!

The glove may leak, or you may sweat. Few ski gloves will resist being
submerged in water - IMO all will leak water (even goretex/barrior
gloves, since the membrane will eventually tear under the kind of use a
glove is subjected to.) So keeping water off the gloves is important -
and if they lose heat too easily the heat melts the snow and you've got
water on, and therefore in the gloves; so you're back to studying the
layers and warmth and windresistence.


Or is it possible to have a glove where wetness doesn't result in cold? Are
the two not necessarily related?

Absolutely - in fact you put a hypothermic person in warm water to warm
them up. It depends on the glove layers - you want layers that don't
transfer heat wet or dry, and your hand heat will warm any water.

Maybe you need multiple gloves? Change off at midday? Don't forget
different weather gloves - sunny/blizzard/windy/spring all call for
different characteristics. I have four pair in my locker bag, and travel
with even more.



6) He said that his gf, who also has poor circulation and constant
hands of ice, wears these and is happy with them. (I'm not asking
you guys to confirm this, but do you think this is a) true or b) a
tactic to get me to buy a rather pricey pair of gloves?)

A guy with such a track record of bull**** is unlikely to even HAVE a
girl friend, IMO.


Oh, I dunno, a lot of girls fall for BS ... there's also the question of
intentional BS vs. just being wrong. Or, to play devil's advocate, just
disagreeing with someone else =P

BS works even better than dandy candy or quicker liqour, IMExperience.


The main reason I question his glove recommendations is because he didn't seem
to be the type to have circulation issues.

Recommendations are like any other info source - it's as important to
know the why as the what. Why does he say what he says? I'd trust hiim
more if he said "these are the qualities of the gloves we carry; if you
are really cold, you might want to look at these other lines on the web
or a competitor store."



Finally, I'm wondering if buying gloves is the answer at all, or if I
need to keep my body warmer somehow so that it doesn't say
"sayonara!" to my extremities. Thing is, if I dress any warmer than
I do, I'll be sweating when I ski or am standing in line, and even
with wicking fabrics throughout, that causes enough wetness to make
me cold again. Especially as sports bras don't do a great job of
wicking, anyway.

Cold extremities make you cold, warm extremities make you warm. Keep
your hands and head warm and the rest follows. Make sure you have a
good, warm, windproof knit hat - go for those three adjectives before
considering "style."


I have a helmet, so a hat isn't an option. The helmet is pretty warm, though.

My helmet is very warm. What do you mean by "pretty warm?" You shouldn't
lose heat through your head - it'll make your fingers and toes cold.
Really! Has to do with circulation changes.


My body and head are not typically cold -- it's just my fingers and toes.

As a final resort you could try boot heaters - not too expensive, and
some folks swear by them.