Baka Dasai wrote:
On Sat, 29 Jan 2005 14:34:47 -0800, lal_truckee said (and I quote):

Baka Dasai wrote:


I note you didn't quote my comment about how much you'd have to bend a
60 metre radius ski to carve a 10 metre radius turn.

Figure it out yourself - it's not that difficult. I'll give you a hint -
sidecut radius and turn radius are different - think ski angle to the snow.


Um, lal, you don't seem to be reading me. Of course sidecut radius and
turn radius are different - that's why I'm talking about 60 metre skis
carving 10 metre circles.

For your benefit, why don't you check out this carving calculator:

http://members.bellatlantic.net/~vze...lculator1.html

It shows what it takes to carve a 60-metre sidecut ski into a 10-metre
turn:

Speed: 60 km/h
Inclination: 70 degrees
Angulation: 10 degrees

So if you could drag your hip along the snow throughout a 60 kmh turn,
then I guess you could carve a "straight" ski.


When you've figured it out, come back and maybe we'll talk some more -
until then ...


Oh my.

holds up hand I've got a couple of question here.

What exactly are inclination and angulation as used here?

What makes you think I won't be traveling at 60 km/h?

How do these calculators account for the amount the ski
will bend? Based on the weight of the skier? Flexibility
of the skis?

These calculators are for snowboards. Does a ski behave
exactly the same as a snowboard? Answer is yes, but it
would be my opinion that a ski would be easier to flex
(usually) than a snowboard. Also, a longer ski would
flex more than a short snowboard. We ARE talking longer
skis here, in that "straight" skis were skied in lengths
exceeding what is popular today. LAL, for instance still
skis on Volkl P30's in, if I remember, 205cm. My
recollection was that while he could carve nice big arcs,
he preferred going down hill at mach 4.

In my 20's, 40 years ago, I remember having GREAT days
when I would ski down the mountain feeling great, laying
down great big GS turns. Almost no snow was being
thrown up in these turns. The main limiting factor, IMO
to carving in those days was not the ski, it was the boot.

I remember feeling the boot bend sideways. That is, when
I pressed really hard on my edges, the ski did not stay
perpendicular with my shin bone. This was due to the
fact that the boots were bending side to side and not
just fore and aft as they should have been. In other
words the angle of the ski to the snow was not the same
as your angulation (as I understand the word).

As an interesting aside. I have a pair of circa 1965
skis in good working order. I take them out once in a
while. The particular skis I have are easy turning,
gentle, yet competent Head 360's. Today with modern
boots I can hardly get them to turn at all but back then
I thought they were the bomb. My technique has evolved
with the equipment so that it no longer works well with
old style equipment.

At any rate, we certainly could carve with our skis
back then. I think I woke up to the fact that I could
make skis carve when I got my first stiff boots. First
early Langes (first year they came with buckles) and
the really radical Rosemounts which were really neat
when you could get the pads to work right.

VtSkier