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-   -   RFD: create unmoderated newsgroup uk.rec.skiing (http://www.skibanter.com/showthread.php?t=1250)

David Off October 17th 03 09:14 PM

RFD: create unmoderated newsgroup uk.rec.skiing
 
David Mahon wrote:
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----

Presently there are a number of ski and snowboard groups in the
rec.skiing heirarchy however much of the discussion is US
based, even in the subheirarchy for european resorts.


I've nothing against people wanting to set up their own ng but
rec.skiing.resorts.europe pratically is a discussion group for UK skiers.


Wm... October 18th 03 10:41 PM

RFD: create unmoderated newsgroup uk.rec.skiing
 
Sat, 18 Oct 2003 12:22:13
uk.net.news.config Ian Spare

On Fri, 17 Oct 2003 23:14:09 +0200, David Off
wrote:


I've nothing against people wanting to set up their own ng but
rec.skiing.resorts.europe pratically is a discussion group for UK skiers.


Quite, there's no argument I can see that rec.skiing.resorts.europe
isn't working. Diluting it would make it weaker.


Not the point at all. If sufficient people want the group in uk.* and
the naming is sorted out it will happen. Dilution of
rec.skiing.resorts.europe isn't an issue for people concerned with the
uk.* hierarchy.

I do hope this doesn't become F1 revisited.
--
Wm ...
Reply-To: address valid for at least 7 days from date of posting

James Hart October 18th 03 11:40 PM

RFD: create unmoderated newsgroup uk.rec.skiing
 
"Wm..." wrote in message
...
Sat, 18 Oct 2003 12:22:13
uk.net.news.config Ian Spare

On Fri, 17 Oct 2003 23:14:09 +0200, David Off
wrote:


I've nothing against people wanting to set up their own ng but
rec.skiing.resorts.europe pratically is a discussion group for UK

skiers.

Quite, there's no argument I can see that rec.skiing.resorts.europe
isn't working. Diluting it would make it weaker.


Not the point at all. If sufficient people want the group in uk.* and
the naming is sorted out it will happen. Dilution of
rec.skiing.resorts.europe isn't an issue for people concerned with the
uk.* hierarchy.

I do hope this doesn't become F1 revisited.


I've got 5 F1 groups I use on my server, each of them has different
characteristics to each other simply because of who posts to them. If the
skiing group split then I'd imagine the same would happen, presumably the
core posters would stay here and newcomers would chance their arm wherever
they land first.

--
James...
http://www.jameshart.co.uk/



Don Aitken October 19th 03 12:20 AM

RFD: create unmoderated newsgroup uk.rec.skiing
 
On Sat, 18 Oct 2003 23:41:00 +0100, "Wm..."
wrote:

Sat, 18 Oct 2003 12:22:13
uk.net.news.config Ian Spare

On Fri, 17 Oct 2003 23:14:09 +0200, David Off
wrote:


I've nothing against people wanting to set up their own ng but
rec.skiing.resorts.europe pratically is a discussion group for UK skiers.


Quite, there's no argument I can see that rec.skiing.resorts.europe
isn't working. Diluting it would make it weaker.


Not the point at all. If sufficient people want the group in uk.* and
the naming is sorted out it will happen. Dilution of
rec.skiing.resorts.europe isn't an issue for people concerned with the
uk.* hierarchy.

It is if most of the prospective users of the proposed uk.* group are
already using the rec.* group, and prefer to stay where they are. They
would be perfectly entitled to vote no, if they choose.

I do hope this doesn't become F1 revisited.


Repeating the mantra that uk.* doesn't care about the rest of Usenet,
as if that was supposed to be a virtue, is one way of ensuring that it
will.

--
Don Aitken

Mail to the addresses given in the headers is no longer being
read. To mail me, substitute "clara.co.uk" for "freeuk.com".

Wm... October 19th 03 03:50 AM

RFD: create unmoderated newsgroup uk.rec.skiing
 
Sun, 19 Oct 2003 01:20:39
uk.net.news.config Don Aitken

On Sat, 18 Oct 2003 23:41:00 +0100, "Wm..."
wrote:


Not the point at all. If sufficient people want the group in uk.* and
the naming is sorted out it will happen. Dilution of
rec.skiing.resorts.europe isn't an issue for people concerned with the
uk.* hierarchy.

It is if most of the prospective users of the proposed uk.* group are
already using the rec.* group, and prefer to stay where they are.


They just stay were they are then, simple.

They
would be perfectly entitled to vote no, if they choose.


So? Which bit of "If sufficient people want the group in uk.*" did you
miss?

I do hope this doesn't become F1 revisited.


Repeating the mantra that uk.* doesn't care about the rest of Usenet,
as if that was supposed to be a virtue, is one way of ensuring that it
will.


Whatever ... you beat your drum, I'll say what I think. At the moment I
think I am making more sense than you.

--
Wm ...
Reply-To: address valid for at least 7 days from date of posting

Ian Spare October 19th 03 11:01 AM

RFD: create unmoderated newsgroup uk.rec.skiing
 
On Sat, 18 Oct 2003 23:41:00 +0100, "Wm..."
wrote:

Sat, 18 Oct 2003 12:22:13
uk.net.news.config Ian Spare

On Fri, 17 Oct 2003 23:14:09 +0200, David Off
wrote:


I've nothing against people wanting to set up their own ng but
rec.skiing.resorts.europe pratically is a discussion group for UK skiers.


Quite, there's no argument I can see that rec.skiing.resorts.europe
isn't working. Diluting it would make it weaker.


Not the point at all. If sufficient people want the group in uk.* and
the naming is sorted out it will happen. Dilution of
rec.skiing.resorts.europe isn't an issue for people concerned with the
uk.* hierarchy.


It was the point enough that the RFD was posted into RSRE. If it's not
connected then I'm a loss to see why it was posted there. If you
objected to the RFD being posted in in RSRE then take it up with the
poster.

It's totally mindless to objiect to the RSRE becuase it doesn't have a
UK prefix. Baring a few mindless bigots I can't see who might start
posting to a ski group just becuase it's got a uk prefix so the best
you hope for is take traffic out RSRE which does reduce it and for
what?

David Off October 19th 03 05:00 PM

RFD: create unmoderated newsgroup uk.rec.skiing
 
David Mahon wrote:
snip

I still don't see any need for the group, there's no significant skiing
in the UK, for European skiing r.s.r.e is effectively the discussion
group English speaking skiers, the majority of whom are UK based.

Having seen the experience of the French who set up a ski n.g. which
failed (fr.sport.neige-et-glace) despite a lot of people voting for it
(and they at least have some ski resorts) I'm a bit dubious of the need
to this group. There are far too many useless ng's being set-up IMHO.

Anyway let us know when the vote is so we can exercise our opinion.


Alex Heney October 19th 03 07:43 PM

RFD: create unmoderated newsgroup uk.rec.skiing
 
On Sat, 18 Oct 2003 23:41:00 +0100, "Wm..."
wrote:

Sat, 18 Oct 2003 12:22:13
uk.net.news.config Ian Spare

On Fri, 17 Oct 2003 23:14:09 +0200, David Off
wrote:


I've nothing against people wanting to set up their own ng but
rec.skiing.resorts.europe pratically is a discussion group for UK skiers.


Quite, there's no argument I can see that rec.skiing.resorts.europe
isn't working. Diluting it would make it weaker.


Not the point at all. If sufficient people want the group in uk.* and
the naming is sorted out it will happen.


But is there any indication that there will be?

Dilution of
rec.skiing.resorts.europe isn't an issue for people concerned with the
uk.* hierarchy.


But it is for those who already read this group.

I suspect that several of the readers of this group will vote against,
because they will be worried about the effects a new uk group would
have on this one.

--
Alex Heney, Global Villager
Everybody is ignorant, only on different subjects.

To reply by email, my address is aDOTjDOTheneyATbtinternetDOTcom

Ace October 20th 03 08:15 AM

RFD: create unmoderated newsgroup uk.rec.skiing
 
On Sun, 19 Oct 2003 18:07:15 +0100, David Mahon
wrote:


Here is the charter for RS

For discussion of ski and snowboard resorts in Europe. Discussion of the
pros and cons of different resorts in Europe and the snow conditions at
the different resorts in Europe would be suitable for this group. Other
areas that might be suitable for this group: lodging facilities, grading
of runs, accessibility of ski resorts in Europe. Europe is a
multi-cultural, multi-langauge area. This creates problems of a unique
sort. This group will have no designated language. The language a
poster desires to post in is appropriate. However, to make this work the
multilingual people may desire to interrupt for the people that do not
understand the poster's language of choice.

This is very different to the proposed charter for uk.rec.skiing.


So? As we all know, charters are flexible beasties - it happens that,
partially due to the implosion of RSA, RSRE has become _the_ de-facto
ski discussion group. There's even a fair few merkins who post here
occasionally.

I accept, however, that the name is not the most obvious for newbies,
but I agree with others on here that the new group would, at best,
fragment the existing group.
--
Ace (bruce dot rogers at roche dot com)
Ski Club of Great Britain - http://www.skiclub.co.uk
All opinions expressed are personal and in no way represent those of the Ski Club.

PG October 20th 03 08:16 AM

RFD: create unmoderated newsgroup uk.rec.skiing
 

"David Mahon" wrote in message
...
In article , Ian Spare
writes


..../...

Here is the charter for RS

For discussion of ski and snowboard resorts in Europe. Discussion of

the
pros and cons of different resorts in Europe and the snow conditions

at
the different resorts in Europe would be suitable for this group.

Other
areas that might be suitable for this group: lodging facilities,

grading
of runs, accessibility of ski resorts in Europe. Europe is a
multi-cultural, multi-langauge area. This creates problems of a

unique
sort. This group will have no designated language. The language a
poster desires to post in is appropriate. However, to make this work

the
multilingual people may desire to interrupt for the people that do not
understand the poster's language of choice.

This is very different to the proposed charter for uk.rec.skiing.


This has probably been discussed already, but traffic through rsre is
quite light, and I doubt that this has anything to do with its charter.
As David said a similar attempt in France was totally unsuccessful. It
would make more sense to amend the charter for rsre than to effectively
double up on ngs for a pretty limited readership.

Pete




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