Alpine bindings on Telemark skis?
 

My principal gripe is that my skis are heavier than I'd like
for carrying from my car to the lift.

Long ago I noticed that Telemark and AT (alpine touring) skis
weigh less than downhill skis of any type.

What would happen if I put downhill bindings (e.g. Marker 13.0)
on good telemark skis such as Atomic TM:X or Fischer Stingrays?
One bonus is that these models cost less than most downhill skis.

Or what about an AT ski such as the K2 Shuksan? I've seen those
at Kirkwood, but neglected to ask the owners about them.

The Universe would implode on itself.

I advise against doing it.

Bill Tuthill wrote:
My principal gripe is that my skis are heavier than I'd like
for carrying from my car to the lift.

Put lighter bindings on them. If you heft a pair of downhill skis without
bindings on, you'll be amazed at how light they are.

I've never noticed the weight of skis when walking. Do you put them on your
shoulder?

ant

Bill Tuthill wrote:
My principal gripe is that my skis are heavier than I'd like
for carrying from my car to the lift.

Long ago I noticed that Telemark and AT (alpine touring) skis
weigh less than downhill skis of any type.

What would happen if I put downhill bindings (e.g. Marker 13.0)
on good telemark skis such as Atomic TM:X or Fischer Stingrays?
One bonus is that these models cost less than most downhill skis.

Or what about an AT ski such as the K2 Shuksan? I've seen those
at Kirkwood, but neglected to ask the owners about them.

In my experience, binding have more to do with weight
even than skis. I have a nice light rig in pair of
Salomon 1080's (not specifically AT but not too bad
for weight) with Fritchie Free Ride bindings. DIN to
12 so beefy enough for eastern ice and nice and light.

VtSkier

Bill Tuthill wrote:
My principal gripe is that my skis are heavier than I'd like
for carrying from my car to the lift.

Silly. How much time do you spend walking with skis compared to skiing
on a given ski day. (FWIW, you should be more worried about your boot
soles wearing on the pavement than your ski weight - sole wear will
prematurely wreck your boots.)

Long ago I noticed that Telemark and AT (alpine touring) skis
weigh less than downhill skis of any type.

What would happen if I put downhill bindings (e.g. Marker 13.0)
on good telemark skis such as Atomic TM:X or Fischer Stingrays?
One bonus is that these models cost less than most downhill skis.

Or what about an AT ski such as the K2 Shuksan? I've seen those
at Kirkwood, but neglected to ask the owners about them.

I've got telemark skis (Piste Stinx) mounted with AT bindings (Fritschi
FreeRides) with no trouble. Lots of combinations work. If you're
uncertain of a particular combination, ask your carefully curried shop
technician for guidance (you know the tech I mean - the guy you bring
beer to in the spring as a token of your appreciation throughout the year.)

The reason why many tele skis are lighter than their alpine counterpart
is that the tele skis are made without a metal plate to go under the
foot for alpine binding mounting.

If you are not an agressive, expert skier you can probably get away
with mounting alpine bindings on a tele ski.

snoig

lal_truckee wrote:
Bill Tuthill wrote:

My principal gripe is that my skis are heavier than I'd like
for carrying from my car to the lift.


Silly. How much time do you spend walking with skis compared to skiing
on a given ski day. (FWIW, you should be more worried about your boot
soles wearing on the pavement than your ski weight - sole wear will
prematurely wreck your boots.)

Ah yes, sole wear. A number of boots have replaceable parts or
complete toe and heel pieces. Many of the SureFoot boots have
this feature of complete toe/heel replacement. A few other
brands have a replaceable wear plate. Some, most notably
Salomon, have no replaceable parts. My AT boots have a
Vibram sole which can be replaced by sending them to Lowa.

Now, there is a correlation between sole wear and release
function. Professional ski shops have a "jig" to measure
boot sole thickness at critical areas and also have
parameters for the amount the vertical parts of the boot
sole can be worn away and still be effective.

Having said all of that, most binding toe pieces accomplish
their retainage of the boot at the top of the toe of the
boot and the vertical part of the boot just above the sole.

This suggests that boot sole *bottom* wear may not be
as critical as sometimes suggested. A release check will
determine the limits.

Now I wear AT boots with vibram soles a lot because I have
cause to get out of my skis and walk around a lot during
the course of a "working" ski day. The vibram sole may be
the worst thing to put between your leg and your binding.
Maybe even worse than a severely worn alpine boot sole.

To lessen this effect, I'm a FIRM believer in active AFD
devices. So far, only Marker and Tyrolia (and maybe Atomic)
have devices that I feel comfortable with. Every body else
cheaps out with teflon devices which can accumulate dirt
and not work as advertised, but plenty good enough for
newish alpine boots.

It's a bit late to try this now, but I am planning to take
my AT boots and various skis into my favorite ski shop and
use their release check equipment to test my theories.

So far, and as usual, the only release function I've had
occasion to need, is vertical release (heel) in the last
several seasons, so the boot sole doesn't have much to
do with this function.

I do note that my Fritchie FreeRides don't have an active
AFD but are made to use with AT boots. Perhaps the active
function isn't as necessary as I suspect, or maybe the
use profile of AT bindings (no parking lots) makes it so
they don't lose their function as readily as alpine bindings.

Long ago I noticed that Telemark and AT (alpine touring) skis
weigh less than downhill skis of any type.

What would happen if I put downhill bindings (e.g. Marker 13.0)
on good telemark skis such as Atomic TM:X or Fischer Stingrays?
One bonus is that these models cost less than most downhill skis.

Or what about an AT ski such as the K2 Shuksan? I've seen those
at Kirkwood, but neglected to ask the owners about them.

I've got telemark skis (Piste Stinx) mounted with AT bindings (Fritschi
FreeRides) with no trouble. Lots of combinations work. If you're
uncertain of a particular combination, ask your carefully curried shop
technician for guidance (you know the tech I mean - the guy you bring
beer to in the spring as a token of your appreciation throughout the year.)

I pointed out earlier that I had a pair of Salomon 1080's with
FreeRides and thought they were pretty light, especially as
compared to my Volkl 6stars.

VtSkier
(Oh, and Fred, I do get a little verbose from time to time
an earlier message)

"VtSkier" wrote
SNIP
This suggests that boot sole *bottom* wear may not be
as critical as sometimes suggested. A release check will
determine the limits.

Now I wear AT boots with vibram soles a lot because I have
cause to get out of my skis and walk around a lot during
the course of a "working" ski day. The vibram sole may be
the worst thing to put between your leg and your binding.
Maybe even worse than a severely worn alpine boot sole.

To lessen this effect, I'm a FIRM believer in active AFD
devices. So far, only Marker and Tyrolia (and maybe Atomic)
have devices that I feel comfortable with. Every body else
cheaps out with teflon devices which can accumulate dirt
and not work as advertised, but plenty good enough for
newish alpine boots.
SNIP

VT,
Have you really seen Teflon strips collect dirt and grime so they stop
working? Wouldn't this same dirt and grime cause more havoc in the active
AFD devices? I am sure you have heard of the KISS principle, the Teflon
sounds allot simpler to me. I admit I have not paid attention to active AFD
devices so I would be very interested in your reasoning, and description of
them.

Stephen B.

VtSkier wrote:

Ah yes, sole wear. A number of boots have replaceable parts or
complete toe and heel pieces. Many of the SureFoot boots have
this feature of complete toe/heel replacement. A few other
brands have a replaceable wear plate. Some, most notably
Salomon, have no replaceable parts.

Jeez I hope my Atomics soles are replaceable, as they are completely rooted.
I have had 2 full sesaons on them; in Oz the walk to/from the locker room
was mainly over snow, in the US it was a longish hike across the village. in
my last couple of weeks, I grabbed the boots off the boot dryer by their
heels, and the black parts moved! They are screwed on so I'm assuming they
are replaceable.

I never got to test my bindings' release capabilities this season, somewhat
to my shame.

ant

Stephen B. wrote:
I am sure you have heard of the KISS principle,
the Teflon sounds allot simpler to me.

I am an Salomon binding fan, but I do get annoyed by the ease with which the
white AFDs fall out. Getting them replaced can be a real rigmarole.

ant