ok, let me rephrase the whistler question
if these are the factors:
cost - five months skiing and lodging at whistler, $3800. proximity - condo ski in/ski out, no commute of any kind to mountain. village - whistler village is surely full of life and ammenities, from what i've read it is completely self sustaining so you never have to leave. terrain - whistler has more lift serviced terrain than any other resort in north america. it also appears to be the ultimate big mountain resort with more alpine terrain than anything else on this side of the atlantic. i've never heard a single person criticize the quality of whistlers terrain so im assuming it isn't a matter of quantity over quality. snow quantity - whistler averages 360 inches a year so far so good. snow quality: so far all anyone has said is that it rains a lot at the base, and that the snow is wetter than snow in the interior. my question, for the tenth time, is the snow above the tree line so wet and heavy that it is unenjoyable for a skier, or is it still nice snow just not AS nice as certain other parts of the country? weather: whistler doesn't appear to be the sunshine capital of the world, but then again, snow doesn't fall from the sun and it doesn't seem to get bone chillingly cold very often either. i know weather is an issue for people going for a week or two but is it really an issue for someone living there the entire winter? is this a non issue? crowds: whistler gets a lot of skiers but it also has a lot of terrain to spread everyone out and it seems that its not very hard to get away from the crowds once you get to know the place. non issue? lift lines: how bad are the lift lines during the week? are they only bad on weekends or at the base in the morning before everyone spreads out to the different areas? there is only one potential whistler killer for me and thats the snow quality, i don't need the driest fluff in the world, but i don't want to ski in heavy wet sludge thats not enjoyable.. it doesn't have to be perfect, it just has to be good. there's no one resort that gives that excels at all the factors i listed above, the idea is to go to the one that excels the most overall without failing at any of the important ones. for example staying in banff for the winter would require a 30 to 45 minute commute everday, that fact alone takes banff out of the running for me. the snow at tremblant is nice and dry but that doesn't mean its a better place to spend the winter than whistler. it wouldn't cost any more, you can live right next to the gondola, there aren't any crowds during the week.. BUT you'd need to commute into town anytime you needed something, it has very little interesting terrain, it rarely snows (avg 150"), its usually freezing cold, windy and icey (not a little ice, 90% ice). see how that works? you have to look at every factor, not just one or two. so if you have any suggestions, please feel free.. |
kevin wrote:
snow quality: so far all anyone has said is that it rains a lot at the base, and that the snow is wetter than snow in the interior. my question, for the tenth time, is the snow above the tree line so wet and heavy that it is unenjoyable for a skier, or is it still nice snow just not AS nice as certain other parts of the country? Snow above treeline is usually powdery, just not as powdery as Utah. weather: whistler doesn't appear to be the sunshine capital of the world, but then again, snow doesn't fall from the sun and it doesn't seem to get bone chillingly cold very often either. i know weather is an issue for people going for a week or two but is it really an issue for someone living there the entire winter? is this a non issue? Big problem in Whistler is fog. It doesn't get bone-chillingly cold like the East. The downsides of Whistler are crowds, cost, and fog. It's not foggy every day, however. And if you're there a whole season, you will be there for the low-crowd times as well as the high-crowd times. That leaves cost as the big issue, IMHO. If you didn't like Silver Star, maybe you should stay away from other of the smaller interior BC places mentioned, and just hit the big Kahuna like you seem to want to. That way, you'll have done it and it will be out of the way ;). Dave |
In article , kevin says...
Once again: snow quality: so far all anyone has said is that it rains a lot at the base, and that the snow is wetter than snow in the interior. my question, for the tenth time, is the snow above the tree line so wet and heavy that it is unenjoyable for a skier, or is it still nice snow just not AS nice as certain other parts of the country? As I said before, the snow sucks. Wet and damp. Have you heard anyone here praise it? The best anyone can come up with is 'its OK'. Code words for it sucks. weather: whistler doesn't appear to be the sunshine capital of the world, but then again, snow doesn't fall from the sun and it doesn't seem to get bone chillingly cold very often either. i know weather is an issue for people going for a week or two but is it really an issue for someone living there the entire winter? is this a non issue? Do you like rust? Never seeing the sun for weeks on end? Trust, me I know. crowds: whistler gets a lot of skiers but it also has a lot of terrain to spread everyone out and it seems that its not very hard to get away from the crowds once you get to know the place. non issue? Spreading out is not the issue. Waiting in long lines for ride up is. Better become a freeheeler and skin up. lift lines: how bad are the lift lines during the week? are they only bad on weekends or at the base in the morning before everyone spreads out to the different areas? Long. Very long. there is only one potential whistler killer for me and thats the snow quality, i don't need the driest fluff in the world, but i don't want to ski in heavy wet sludge thats not enjoyable.. it doesn't have to be perfect, it just has to be good. there's no one resort that gives that excels at all the factors i listed above, the idea is to go to the one that excels the most overall without failing at any of the important ones. for example staying in banff for the winter would require a 30 to 45 minute commute everday, that fact alone takes banff out of the running for me. the snow at tremblant is nice and dry but that doesn't mean its a better place to spend the winter than whistler. it wouldn't cost any more, you can live right next to the gondola, there aren't any crowds during the week.. BUT you'd need to commute into town anytime you needed something, it has very little interesting terrain, it rarely snows (avg 150"), its usually freezing cold, windy and icey (not a little ice, 90% ice). see how that works? you have to look at every factor, not just one or two. so if you have any suggestions, please feel free.. Go somewhere else. If you have but one season to be a bum, find a resort with the highest quality snow you can get (I would choose the northern Rockies). You will never forget that season. Everyone deserves al least one epic season and the Rockies offer the best chance. I just don't think you will an unforgetable experience at a coastal range resort. BoftheW |
snow quality: so far all anyone has said is that it rains a lot at the
base, and that the snow is wetter than snow in the interior. my question, for the tenth time, is the snow above the tree line so wet and heavy that it is unenjoyable for a skier, or is it still nice snow just not AS nice as certain other parts of the country? Snow above treeline is usually powdery, just not as powdery as Utah. perfect. The downsides of Whistler are crowds, cost, and fog. It's not foggy every day, however. And if you're there a whole season, you will be there for the low-crowd times as well as the high-crowd times. That leaves cost as the big issue, IMHO. cost isn't an issue, as i stated we have lodging for $600 a month each in a nice place, and thats cheaper rent than i pay now and $900 for a midweek season pass is a great deal as far as i'm concerned. If you didn't like Silver Star, maybe you should stay away from other of the smaller interior BC places mentioned, and just hit the big Kahuna like you seem to want to. That way, you'll have done it and it will be out of the way ;). exactly :) don't get me wrong, silver star is the best skiing i've ever had in my entire life, but its not so radically different from what we have out east.. its a fantastic place to visit, but i wouldn't want to live there. eventually when i have more money i'd like to spend the winter touring some of the better mountains in bc/alberta, i'd like to go to utah, i'd like to ski in the alps, i'd like to spend a week heli-skiing.. but all of that costs SO much more than it will cost us to live five minutes from a gondola in whistler for five months. |
kevin wrote:
snow quantity - whistler averages 360 inches a year Bummer. I wouldn't make it through the season. -klaus |
Just a few comments on a few points...
kevin wrote: : terrain - whistler has more lift serviced terrain than any other resort : in north america. it also appears to be the ultimate big mountain resort : with more alpine terrain than anything else on this side of the atlantic. : i've never heard a single person criticize the quality of whistlers terrain : so im assuming it isn't a matter of quantity over quality. Whistler/Blackcomb does have some very expansive terrain, bowls that would encompass whole ski areas. It's got some very challenging terrain. The terrain is great. BTW, Vail+Breck total claim is 7332 acres, Whistler/BC claims 7071. In my opinion, however, quantity is far from the top measure. What kind of terrain is it? What type do you want to ski - trees? alpine? How much beginner/intermediate/expert terrain is there? : snow quantity - whistler averages 360 inches a year Vail claims 346 inches per year - pretty close. Steamboat gets ~360. SLC west areas ~500. Jackson ~450. All much, much better snow in general. : snow quality: so far all anyone has said is that it rains a lot at the : base, and that the snow is wetter than snow in the interior. my question, : for the tenth time, is the snow above the tree line so wet and heavy that : it is unenjoyable for a skier, or is it still nice snow just not AS nice : as certain other parts of the country? I've never had heavier, wetter, more impossible snow than at Whistler, above treeline ("in the alpine"). You simply would never get that kind of snow in the Rockies, or even in CA in my (limited) experience. It was RAINING on the lower ~3K feet. In *January*. Ok, I didn't have fat skis - they would've helped in that glop. Otherwise it was pretty much unskiable (unless groomed) - tips dove to China unless you were forcefully leaning back. On the other hand - the snow can be good too. It's just that the bell curve is a lot flatter - a lot more variation is possible. It don't rain in Utah or Colorado in January. I can't address the party or convenience features of the more interior resorts of Canada or the US (and those appear to be very important to you), but I'd much rather be in Jackson or in Sandy UT or near Kicking Horse than a winter at Whistler. But plenty of people do it and love it. It's a great place to visit, but... If you're really enamored of the bigness of it all, then no place will match it. I found most of Blackcomb to be kinda Vail-like, myself - but certainly not all of it. Whistler seemed to be quite a bit more interesting overall. I'd take Jackson over either of them in an instant. One of the latest ski mags has a piece on the 10 best ski-and-live towns - check it out for yet another view of this and a some more actual data. Best of luck with whatever you decide for this winter! -Paul C. |
Paul Christofanelli wrote:
I've never had heavier, wetter, more impossible snow than at Whistler, above treeline ("in the alpine"). You simply would never get that kind of snow in the Rockies, or even in CA in my (limited) experience. [clip] Ok, I didn't have fat skis - they would've helped in that glop. Otherwise it was pretty much unskiable (unless groomed) Heavy, wet, glop has it's good side - once you learn how to ski it (skinny skis work just fine, if you have good technique. and wax.) you will find that you have the mountain pretty much to yourself. No waiting, no crossing tracks, no people, period. (Work on your technique - and for gawds sake dump those fat skis somewhere where a beginner can find them - everyone will be better off...) However, I will agree that conditions are very much better uner certain other conditions. For example I offer a raging -10deg blizzard with 60mph winds - fresh light snow and yet again "No waiting, no crossing tracks, no people, period." (except for a like minded few, all of whom you know, and meet for beer while cuddling up to the woodburner in the warming hut every hour or so. The way skiing ought to be. |
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bdubya wrote:
But were I you, my first priority after settling in would be to develop the skills (and compile the gear and the connections) to access the backcountry. It'd be a shame to be there all season and be limited to the lifts. I think in that area it might take more than a year to get proficient enough to do that safely. Find a mentor. -klaus |
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